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XW-P1 to Control a Midi Synth via Din connector (Please ReadP


szetek

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I am on 1.11 and have been unsuccessful in disallowing Program Change in Controlling other Modules via Midi. I have found the following but it does not seem to do what I was to believe it would, Thanks,,,,please advise.

 

"" Improvements Provided by This Update
Version 1.10 >> Version 1.11
• Improved operation of the external part volume.
• Improved certain operation.
Version 1.01 >> Version 1.10

• Adds "MIDI EDIT" in Performance Edit Mode.
Press the "PERFORM" button and then press the "EDIT" button to display the Performance editing screen..
You can find the following entry under "Phr Enable" in the list.

Display Description Settings
Mixer OUT Specifies whether or not the value is transmitted by editing Zone 1-4. Off, On
PrgBnk Out Specifies whether or not value is transmitted by changing Tone Number.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Prg.. Only Program Change, Bnk.. Both Program Change and Bank MSB/LSB. Off, Prg, Bnk
PrgBnk Edit This group includes program and bank value. When you press "ENTER", you can edit the following list. it is transmitted when the performance number is changed.
Bank MSB Specifies Bank MSB Value. 0 to 127
Bank LSB Specifies Bank LSB Value. 0 to 127
Prog Chg Specifies Program Change Value. 1 to 128 <<
""

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Would it help to "Initialize" the Keyboard (XW-P1)? I do have some patches (the moog ones) but I suppose I can reinstall them if they are overwritten..any patches I made can be built again easily.  But doesn't someone else here use a slave module that they have set so the XW won't change the patches on the slave when making changes to the XW?

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I was supposed to get a "call" from Casio Support on this issue, I have not received any calls yet.  I am surprised that I have not heard of anyone else having this question or possibly a solution to this is issue of global settings and Midi interface.  I can just "box" it up.... But I am not one to just give up so easily.  I However may grab another keyboard just to negate the frustration until this is resolved.  Out of curiosity are we left here to out own devices or is their a "Casio" Tech that is truly trained to read these issues and interact here?

Big Thanks.

 

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2 hours ago, Scott Hamlin said:

Are you able to disable this for either tone changes or performances changes? 

 

Hi Scott,

I am not quite understanding what you mean by "disable", But "No"  I can not disable the output of program or bank change from anywhere with success. In the Menu it states either "Off" under "program Bank". < I have checked to make sure all zones are "off". If there is another place to also change this in a "more" Global command or setting I have not seen it. Thanks for reading. I hope you can help me resolve this one.  I usually can figure these out but this is not making sense.

 

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Just now, Scott Hamlin said:

Yes I mean disable as in turning off the program change send. So it sends whether you are changing tones  or changing performances? I ask because to me it looks like their are two settings there - one for each area. 

 

 

Yes, as I described above. It is turned "Off"

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47 minutes ago, BradMZ said:

Are you in tone mode and changing tones or performance mode and changing performances?  

 

 

It does not matter, you can turn the wheel that changes patches in "any" Mode.  They all allow the Prog/Bank change via Midi Out.  There should be a global Prog change "off" that works....or if there is one that I am missing than I need to know where it is.

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All changes to the address of any sound is transmitted to the external module. Via button. even to change from preset or Bank. "All" buttons that make a change on the XW will also change the External Module. "Page 20" , And Yes, I always save and double check for the settings .

 

 

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When making the change to the value to "off" for the zones 1,2,3,4 for the Program Change it "should" and has effected all patches. I can not bring up a Patch that has "Program Change" "enabled" for "Bank" or "Prog" after turning this feature off. I believe that if you turn it on then that is where you might point it to various addresses. (and that would be miserable in committing a patch change to always be with the one on the XW. (even if it is chosen by myself and not the machine)),  As soon as I were to add or replace any module it would be a waste.  And very impractical. I am starting to believe that in the last updates they missed this.  in the change rev 1.01 > 1.10 there was big changes made to midi program change. It worked at one point though. I know as I had to wrestle through this before.  But in the past I made the changes (once I found the settings)and then I was doing fine. So, in these updates I can see no other answer other than a setting that has not been addressed or an issue in the firmware upgrades that needs correction.

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3 hours ago, BradMZ said:

Ok. So it worked at one point?  Have you tried the initialize yet?  Also, I know this sounds crazy but playing the demo song for a second acts like a midi panic button on Casio products.  Try that as well just to rule out everything. 

 

 

Yes, it worked a few years back when I got it and that was the time I met Scott and was introduced into the ipad stuff.  I had to really work with it but that was one thing I was able to do as long as I used the Midi Din (not usb) in controlling how and what was sent and received ( this was back and forth between my alesis io dock which was basically being treated just like a module. After that I went on and added a few other rack modules so I could drive them with my XW.  I have done this kinda stuff for quite a long time.  I was driving a korg rack wavestation and something else...maybe the other Emu. But point is I always make my setup to disable program changes because I am not going to get stuck marrying the modules and designated sounds to one another...it is incredibly lengthy process and then on another song you will just end up changing things anyway. SO, it is much easier to write down what I want and then go from there...or if you are editing it can really drive you wild too.  

As far as the demo song, I will play it. And yes I did initialize the XW earlier today I think it was. But no changes.

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So as the weekend begins that makes it over 3 days since Casio escalated this to 3rd tier support.  I am surprised they did not call like they said they would.  I guess I will have to deal with calling them on the Monday.   I hope they are serious about resolving this.

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7 minutes ago, XW-Addict said:

So the problem is that when connecting the XW to another external midi module, you're getting unwanted program changes. 

while in changing modes or increment of tones. 

 

 

Yes, when going from one patch to another. ( in any or all modes) the XW sends out via midi for the external module to also change it's patch or current program.  This used to not be the case but it seems that after some firmware upgrade that either I am not seeing the correct setting or it was overlooked by the developers in the current update.

Thanks. (any ideas are appreciated)

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Ok, well I am glad to say I made some progress.  I am not by any means finished but I at least was able to stop program changes from being transmitted when in "performance" mode and also jumping to the "Step Sequencer' mode. (that typically would just throw the other synth or module into another bank and/or patch.  I found this documentation here http://support.casio.com/storage/en/manual/pdf/EN/008/XWP1_midi_EN.pdf  

and after reading this for quite awhile..... I never wanted to get incredibly deep into the midi stuff though I always end up having to do it anyway.  I had the XW also ignoring changes when I was in the "tone" mode as well but now I can't seem to figure what the setting is for that one.  I did a full initialize because I had been all over the settings and will probably have to reload those Moog patches.   But the 2 places I switched from "off" to "on" was under "settings" and then "midi' and then all the way down to "Performnrpn" = on (go figure) and "S.Seqnrpn" = on (mmm hmm). So Maybe someone else may take this a bit further,,,,,I mean if we don't then I don't know who will. I will post what I find out when Casio Support 3rd tier calls next week. I am kinda burned out but had to play a bit before I typed this out.  For those that do memorize all these sheets and know the midi stuff inside out I salute you...where ever you are lol.  About 20 years ago I was a lot more fresh with it and like most things if you don't do it a lot you sometimes have to bring the memory back to the surface.  Just remember, "never give up", It is a good motto to live by if you want to drive yourself crazy.... (I mean be successful) ;-}

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That is also a way to do it  :)  , there are a few way's to prevent the switching for program changes turning all nrpn to off

as you've found out already. Or / and prevent to set the external module from sending an midi program change event where 

it only must receive. 

 

Or using a midi file and edit setting program changes switching to off by setting them with midi events. This way 

it could be set by the XW when you play it but this was suggested earlier.    

 

You can also keep a file to load those settings in the XW that way you don't have to perform all kind of button pressing

that is by setting both methods on the XW and save that state. 

 

The XW can save an all data file  as well an all setting file, an all setting file saves the changes of the state the XW, This 

can be midi related or one of the many initial settings of the menu's. It can be saved by pressing the setting button scroll to card utility 

press enter and from there you can either save or load you're settings.

 

That way you don't have to go through a tedious process.  

 

(btw) me thinks you're going to have more chances this to be resolved here then waiting for a call we're  the savvy ones :D.

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9 minutes ago, XW-Addict said:

That is also a way to do it  :)  , there are a few way's to prevent the switching for program changes turning all nrpn to off

as you've found out already. Or / and prevent to set the external module from sending an midi program change event where 

it only must receive. 

 

Or using a midi file and edit setting program changes switching to off by setting them with midi events. This way 

it could be set by the XW when you play it but this was suggested earlier.  

 

You can also keep a file to load those settings in the XW that way you don't have to perform all kind of button pressing

that is by setting both methods on the XW and save that state. 

 

The XW can save an all data file  as well an all setting file, an all setting file saves the changes of the state the XW, This 

can be midi related or one of the many initial settings of the menu's. It can be saved by pressing the setting button scroll to card utility 

press enter and from there you can either save or load you're settings.

 

That way you don't have to go through a tedious process.  

 

(btw) me thinks you're going to have more chances this to be resolved here then waiting for a call we're  the savvy ones :D.

 

 

"Also a way to do it"???  It has been so far the "only" way to get even close.  Please, do list "any" other conventional ways to accomplish the task at hand  And please re-read as I did not set the menu items (nrpn) to "OFF"> I set those both to "ON".  If you do actually have a simple way for me to accomplish my task without some drawn out writing of a program then please.  (Do Share).  I am still amazed that I can not simply turn program changes "off" and be done with it.   ( and as I also stated above I "did" set the "prog change" to "off"), >and that did not help at all. 

Please keep in mind I have spent days upon days and very late, long hours to get this far. 

You have referenced "earlier suggested", I did everything "suggested" earlier with no result.

It sounds as if you have the "answers" but for some reason have chosen not to actually list any steps or Menu settings to stop the "Program Change".  For instance you mention an "All Data File" or an "All settings File" but give no directions or script for me to use?  I still believe that doing so would be something that would only be done for some exotic setup.  This is just very straight forward though the options have eluded "all" that I have corresponded with, including myself until this last breakthrough.

So far what I have done is "done" until I find the other settings to turn off the "tone" mode from sending midi program changes or a "Global" Setting to "Stop" the XW from making the changes as do most, if not all of my other Synths.....With the changes I made so far I do not have to do anything but turn the XW "on".  I am now able to at least play without being encumbered by constantly correcting the changes that the XW was sending to the other Module/s.  And the "External" Module can not send any changes to the XW as I do not have a MIDI connection going "IN" the XW.  I did however set everything on the external Module to ignore any changes coming from the XW.  And I only have the XW connected from the "out" to the "IN" on the Module.  

As for the "Casio Tech Support",  I surely hope that in the "third tier" they are a lot more knowledgeable than what I have experienced with them so far.

Though I am eager for some positive direction on this issue I am still confused in your responses.  For some reason I think maybe my situation may have sounded familiar to some other post or?  I would not want information to become misconstrued for someone else that reads this and may want to simply make the "Correct" settings to do so.  This is why I not only listed what changes I made but suggested that if anyone finds what I have done familiar or suddenly comes up with a more direct approach to please share.  I will find the other settings eventually and post them as I go....and also any helpful info from Casio support.

I hope this will clarify and as I mentioned it may help to re-read from the top.

Sincerely,

Szetek

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It is interesting as I am going through a lot of the XW that I might not had to I am thinking that there are a lot of possibilities in using the XW-P1 for controlling other synths or modules as there is no doubt that there are many types of Midi implementation that is accessible in directing from the XW.   I know for many of us it is a good synth for getting real nice leads and pads but no doubt if someone were to start assigning those midi signals to places unknown that you could come up with some pretty great compilations.  (Still looking forward to finding the controls that I had set to turn off some of the other midi signals).  Once I learn where to turn them "off" I should be able learn how to assign them for other projects.

Hope all are having a nice weekend....I will be turning it on again later and see if I need to reinstall those Moog patches that someone made..sorry, I forgot who it was that made those.  i think they are pretty well known here though.

Cheers,

Szetek

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