One DSP effect disabled with split tones?

[Tson]

The following is a quote from the PX-560 forum, but I am curious if this also applies to the MZ. 

 

“The PX-560 is limited to a single DSP insert effect for upper and lower tones.  If you choose more than one tone designed to use DSP, only one of them will have the effect.  Some of the piano tones also use DSP insert effects. Since piano is upper 1, it takes the only available DSP resource.“

 

 Ref: MZ-X Users Guide - (Basics), pg. EN-18

 

1) On the MZ, Is there one or two DSP’s?  (I am assuming one for Tones and one for Mic input)??

 

2) According to MZ user’s guide pg 18, in split mode, “if both tones have an effect, one will be disabled.”  Which one?

 

3) What If two tones with effect are layered?  Which one is disabled?

 

Thanks.

 

 

 

[Brad Saucier]

Yes it applies to the MZ-X500 as well.  

 

There are two DSP line resources in the MZX series.  One of them is reserved for the upper/lower tones, and one is reserved for the rhythm section/midi recorder.

 

It's possible to use a tone with DSP in any of the upper/lower parts.  You just have to make sure none of the other upper/lower parts are using a tone with DSP.  That's the simplest way to view it.

 

The DSP resource allocation system in the MZ is sort of complex to explain.  There are two scenarios, both hinged on what's occuring at upper 1......

 

Whenever upper 1 is using DSP line 1, that part takes precedence over all others.  Upper 2, Lower 1 and Upper 2 cannot take DSP Line 1 away from upper 1.  If tones with DSP are chosen for the other parts, they will not have a DSP effect.  

 

Whenever upper 1 is NOT using DSP Line 1, Upper 2, Lower 1 and Lower 2 will consecutively take DSP line 1 away from each other.  The last tone chosen for those parts will have an effect, leaving the first 2 without an effect.  

 

Having said that, there is a workaround to have both DSP lines working on all parts.  It's a one-time use method that can't be stored as a registration.  Use the mixer to manually assign DSP lines, the effects menu to manually assign DSP algorithms, and tone editing to tweak DSP parameters.  

[Tson]

Thanks, Brad.  Excellent explanation, as always.

[Casio Key]

And Casio CT-X 5000?

[Brad Saucier]

1 hour ago, casiokey said:

And Casio CT-X 5000?

 

The CT-X series is different.  CT-X series models have 3 DSP lines and two independent system effects sources.  Like the MZ-X series, only 1 tone with DSP can be used at any given time in upper/lower parts.  Unlike the MZ-X series, a rhythm can have 2 tones with DSP effects and it's own system effects (reverb, delay, chorus) independent from upper and lower tones. Individual DSP effects are also different on the CT-X series.  A tone with a DSP effect on the CT-X series can be made of up to 4 effects algorithms (blocks) at once, where previous models like the MZ-X series was limited to 1 DSP algorithm.  The page link below has a good diagram that shows the effects system on the CT-X series.  The "conventional" diagram describes the MZ-X series and the "AiX" diagram describes the CT-X series. 

 

https://music.casio.com/en/products/keyboards/high_grade/ctx/features/sound_voice/

[Silvano Silva]

DSP on the Casio MZ-X works like Schrödinger's Cat. 
Sometimes the DRAWBAR sound gets Leslie disabled and the sound only works by selecting DRAWBAR on UPPER1.
 Some MZ-X Rhythms have some DSP sounds, which ends up disabling that drum sound you have edited with COMPRESSOR 
that you want to put into rhythm. 
 Attention to guitars, organs and other items.

 

[Brad Saucier]

3 hours ago, Silvano Silva said:

DSP on the Casio MZ-X works like Schrödinger's Cat.

 

There is no mystery to it.  I thoroughly explained how the system works in the post above.  Everything is predictable and can be proven.  

[Frankie J]

Thanks for the articulate explanation Brad.

 

I have a naive (dumb) question/comment: Is there a simpler way to determine if a Tone is DSP or Direct other than looking the Tone up in the Appendix?

Wouldn't it be nice if there was a little dot on the touch screen or something like that to indicate a DSP Tone?

I think that would make choosing Tone combinations much easier, no?

[Brad Saucier]

@Frankie J If it's the MZX series, we have a couple of ways to see if a tone is a DSP tone. Probably the quickest way is to press the menu button, go to the mixer, scroll down to the Line Select section.  If all of them read as OFF, it's not using DSP.  Another way is to press the tone button, press edit on one of the tones, press effect and look at the algorithm setting.  If it shows "through", it is not using DSP.  

 

If it is the CT-X3000/5000, it's even easier.  Casio added a dot to the screen that indicates if the tone is a DSP tone or not.  

[Frankie J]

Got it! Thanks a lot Brad! I've got an MZ-X500 and just now checked it out. Your explanation helps a lot.

Of course, I guess I could just memorize them all, too 😁.

 

It's a bit overwhelming how much there is to learn about this fantastic instrument but this forum, with great experts such as yourself, helps tremendously.