New owner? Have questions?

[Mike Martin]

Ask away.

[chuckbutler]

OK, first questions:

 

1. You mentioned the firmware upgrade. Is that ready to go, and are there instructions somewhere on how to download and apply?

2. What's the status of the Mac editor you mentioned and, if it's ready, where do I get it?

3. I wonder if you would post a few details about how you set up Set List Maker. For example

a) I take it that you found a cable that would allow you to connect the iPad directly to the PX-5S?

Set List Maker accepts 3 values for sending patch changes on a given channel. How do each of these correspond to the different sections of the PX-5S? IOW, what values in those three Set List Maker fields would allow me to access various banks and stage setups in the 5S?

c) If I connect the iPad to the PX-5S via USB, can I connect the 5S's MIDI out to send patch change data through to a second keyboard on an alternate MIDI channel from Set List Maker? Or would I need an interface such as iConnectMIDI to accomplish that?

 

And thanks for your willingness to provide support!

[Mike Martin]

1.  There will be instructions with the update when it is posted next week.

 

2.  The editor comes out at the same time as the firmware

 

3.  I can a little later when I have some more time.  Basically Bank #121 and a normal patch change accesses all the Stage Settings.

 

The USB and MIDI i/O are independent so you can use the iPad for some things while still controlling another keyboard over MIDI. 

[chuckbutler]

The USB and MIDI i/O are independent so you can use the iPad for some things while still controlling another keyboard over MIDI. 

 

Here's where I was going with this. I use two keyboards in my rig: the 5S and a Roland. I want to use Set List Maker to change patches on both keyboards when I select a song from a setlist. So if I connect the iPad directly to the USB port on the 5S, can I then run a MIDI cable out of the 5S and in to the Roland such that the Roland will receive patch changes sent from Set List Maker. IOW, can the 5S pass a MIDI message received at its USB port through to its MIDI out? Or do I need an iOS MIDI interface to accomplish this?

[Mike Martin]

You need the "camera kit" adapter to connect your iPad to the PX-5S over USB

[chuckbutler]

OK, got the camera connection kit, Set List Maker is working perfectly--and even better--I now see that you've thoughtfully provided all of the Bank and Program change info in the Tone List in the Reference section of the (downloadable) Tutorial Guide. Perfect!

 

I haven't tried sending program changes through the 5S to my Roland as described above yet; still not clear as to whether that's even possible.

[chuckbutler]

I haven't tried sending program changes through the 5S to my Roland as described above yet; still not clear as to whether that's even possible.

 

The answer is: it *is* possible. Sys > MIDI > MIDI Out Select and set to "USB". This routes MIDI received at the 5S's USB port back out to its MIDI out port. So my chain:

 

iPad (Set List Maker) > PX-5S (USB) > Roland XP-80 (MIDI in from 5S MIDI out) is all I need to get both keyboards to respond to program changes from the iPad. I have one minor issue with changing between Patch & Performance mode on the XP-80, but I'll take that up with Arlo.

[chuckbutler]

Hey Mike,

 

Is there a setting to make a patch monophonic rather than polyphonic (like for synth leads or basses)?

[Mike Martin]

Hi Chuck,

No that is not possible on the PX-5S, there is not a monophonic mode.

[SonnyDaye]

Hi Mike!

Can you control 6 different sounds, 1 sound for each of the 6 sliders? Or is this limited to 4 because of the 4 zone limit?

Here's what I want to do:

Slider 1: Sound 1, Zone 1

Slider 2: Sound 2, Zone 2

Slider 3: Sound 3, Zone 3

Slider 4: Sound 4, Zone 4

Slider 5: Sound 5, Zone 4

Slider 6: Sound 6, Zone 4

I want to control the volume of each of the 6 sounds INDEPENDENTLY by the 6 sliders.

Is this possible, or would there be a problem controlling the volume of sounds 4, 5 and 6 INDEPENDENTLY because they are all assigned to the same zone?

Thanks!

This is probably an elementary question for people who understand Midi.....but Midi keeps me up nights!

[chuckbutler]

Basically Bank #121 and a normal patch change accesses all the Stage Settings.

 

This doesn't seem to be working for me, Mike. From Set List Maker, I can access all the Tone banks using the Bank select info provided in the Reference. Works perfectly. But entering Bank 121 (MSB) and a program number doesn't change the Stage Setting, it just calls up a new Tone within the current Stage Setting. (In SLM I'm entering Bank MSB as 121, I'm leaving LSB blank, and then the program number.)

 

Here's a deeper conceptual question, though. Most of the time I'm using the 5S for "core" keyboard sounds (esp. piano) and doing other stuff on my second keyboard. But there are certain cases where I need more heavily layered stuff from the 5S. I initially thought that I should create these sounds as Stage Settings, however now I'm thinking that this could present a problem with running patch changes from Set List Maker. For example, most of the time I can use a basic Stage Setting and just change the current Zone 1 Tone. This is working great with SLM. But now suppose we go to a song that requires a different Stage Setting (for a big, layered sound). OK, assuming you can tell me how to get SLM to change Stage Settings, that should be no problem. But now, when that song is over, I want to go back to my "basic" Stage Setting AND to a specific tone. That's means I would need to send TWO patch changes to the 5S: one to get back to the "basic" Stage Setting, and another to call the Tone that I need loaded for the next song. And I think sending two patch changes to the same instrument from a single MIDI preset in SLM is a problem, unless the Stage Setting can be changed via raw sysex somehow.

 

So now I'm thinking that I should either (a) program hex patches for all my layered sounds and never change my basic Stage Setting, or ( create individual Stage Settings for ALL of the sounds I'll need for my live show (layered or not) so that I never have to leave the Stage Settings bank. Any thoughts on that?

[Mike Martin]

Yes what you're asking can be done.   One clarification though - the multi-layer tones (HexLayers) have to be on either Zone 1 or Zone 2.  So a better example might be this:

 

Slider 1: Layer 1, Zone 1
Slider 2: Layer 2, Zone 1
Slider 3: Layer 3, Zone 1
Slider 4: Sound 4, Zone 2
Slider 5: Sound 5, Zone 3
Slider 6: Sound 6, Zone 4

[Mike Martin]

Chuck,
I'm very sorry I messed up.  It is BANK 112.   This should fix you up.

[chuckbutler]

Chuck,

I'm very sorry I messed up.  It is BANK 112.   This should fix you up.

 

No problem, Mike. Yes; Bank 112 does indeed allow me to change Stage Settings. Great!

 

But as I suspected this creates a challenge re change patches with Set List Maker. Let's say I normally use Stage Setting 0-0 as my basic setting. I can then change patches within that Setting using (for example) Bank MSB 66, Program 0 to call up a Rock Organ or any other patch I need. But if I send Bank 112, Program 6 to change to a custom layered Stage Setting, the next time I select my MIDI Preset (in SLM) to call a piano (64,0) it changes the tone in Zone 1 of Stage Setting 6. So the question is: is there a way to get Set List Manager to send a Stage Setting bank/program change followed by a "regular" patch change. Maybe this is a question for Arlo. And thanks again for your help; your time is most appreciated.

[Mike Martin]

Chuck,

I'm not sure that I'd ever use SLM to change sounds within Stage Settings, rather than just change Stage Settings themselves.  I guess that is my personal preference. You can do it that way but you'd have to make sure that each individual tone had the proper effects configured.  Using Stage Settings for everything guarantees that each sound will have the right effects and controls over that sound (if needed).

 

[SonnyDaye]

Yes what you're asking can be done.   One clarification though - the multi-layer tones (HexLayers) have to be on either Zone 1 or Zone 2.  So a better example might be this:

 

Slider 1: Layer 1, Zone 1

Slider 2: Layer 2, Zone 1

Slider 3: Layer 3, Zone 1

Slider 4: Sound 4, Zone 2

Slider 5: Sound 5, Zone 3

Slider 6: Sound 6, Zone 4

Thanks for that info Mike.......that's GREAT news for me (actually THE reason I bought the PX-5S).

And I HAD read in the manual that the hex layers had to be on Zone 1 or 2. For me, for now, I'm just planning on using 6 "normal" sounds. I can't wait to set it up so I can mix the volumes of 6 sounds, live in real time on the gig - I won't tell you how many DECADES I have been waiting for this capability on a good pro, lightweight, hammer action board! Thanks!

[Mike Martin]

Very soon (later this week) there will be a firmware update.  One of the things they've added are zone on/off controls and layer on/off controls.  So rather the the sliders functioning as volume they can function as switches.  Although Polyphony should never been an issue with the PX-5S this is a different way to control the zones.

 

Also don't forget each slider/knob can do two assignments.  So one slider could control the volume of two things simultaneously which is great for crossfades.  With the slider up you get one sound, with the slider down you get another.  With the slider in the middle you hear both.

[chuckbutler]

Chuck,

I'm not sure that I'd ever use SLM to change sounds within Stage Settings, rather than just change Stage Settings themselves.  I guess that is my personal preference. You can do it that way but you'd have to make sure that each individual tone had the proper effects configured.  Using Stage Settings for everything guarantees that each sound will have the right effects and controls over that sound (if needed).

 

Maybe you're right. My thinking was that there are a lot of sounds I use during a gig that don't need extensive control options and could basically "live" under a single Stage Setting; my concern was that I may need more than 100 Settings to cover my regular band's rather extensive book (not to mention setups I'll need for other artists I perform with). Let me think this through and see if there are enough Stage Settings to hold everything I need.

 

Arlo (at SLM) suggested that if I knew the raw sysex to change a Stage Setting patch I could enter that in SLM accomplish what I want. Do you happen to know how the hex would need to be formatted to make that work?

[Mike Martin]

Arlo (at SLM) suggested that if I knew the raw sysex to change a Stage Setting patch I could enter that in SLM accomplish what I want. Do you happen to know how the hex would need to be formatted to make that work?

 

When a bank/program change will work to change Stage Settings, and bank/program changes can be used to select tones within a Stage Setting why would you want to do it with Sysex?  

[chuckbutler]

When a bank/program change will work to change Stage Settings, and bank/program changes can be used to select tones within a Stage Setting why would you want to do it with Sysex?  

 

As I was attempting to describe above, if I use one of my Stage Settings as a "master" (within which various tones can be called by SLM), but periodically switch to a different Stage Setting for other songs, when I go back to my "master" Stage Setting I need SLM to send both the Stage Setting change AND call up the right tone within the Stage Setting (which may not be the one that is stored with the "master" Stage Setting. SLM can't send 2 patch changes from a single MIDI Preset, unless one of them is sent by raw sysex. So I could use sysex to change the Stage Setting (if I knew the hex formatting) and then the regular program change fields to call the correct Tone.

 

Arlo may consider adding the functionality that would allow this, but currently has no timetable. My current plan is to take your advice above and see if I can do everything I need using only Stage Settings, so it may be that I can avoid going the sysex route.

[SonnyDaye]

Yes what you're asking can be done.   One clarification though - the multi-layer tones (HexLayers) have to be on either Zone 1 or Zone 2.  So a better example might be this:

 

Slider 1: Layer 1, Zone 1

Slider 2: Layer 2, Zone 1

Slider 3: Layer 3, Zone 1

Slider 4: Sound 4, Zone 2

Slider 5: Sound 5, Zone 3

Slider 6: Sound 6, Zone 4

Are you saying that you HAVE TO use HexLayers to get up to the 6 sound total since there are only four zones?

I tried using 6 NON-HexLayers Tones. I couldn't figure out how to get the 6's volumes controlled individually by sliders 1 - 6.

When I got up to the 5th and 6th tones, TWO DIFFERENT sliders wound up controlling the volume of sound 5. (I'm assuming it has something to do with the fact that there is a max of 4 zones).

Mike, you said it COULD be done, but I can't figure out how to assign ONLY ONE slider to control the volume of sound 5 (or 6).

What am I doing wrong?

Again, here's what I want to do:

Slider 1: Sound 1, Zone 1

Slider 2: Sound 2, Zone 2

Slider 3: Sound 3, Zone 3

Slider 4: Sound 4, Zone 4

Slider 5: Sound 5, Zone 4

Slider 6: Sound 6, Zone 4

I want to control the volume of each of the 6 sounds INDEPENDENTLY by the 6 sliders.

Is this possible, or would there be a problem controlling the volume of sounds 4, 5 and 6 INDEPENDENTLY because they are all assigned to the same zone?

Every screen I saw had one of the four zones listed on the screen, so evidently any slider that controls a zone will control ANY sound that was set up using the same zone, as seen on the screen. Hope I'm describing the situation clearly. Thanks!

[Mike Martin]

Are you saying that you HAVE TO use HexLayers to get up to the 6 sound total since there are only four zones?

I tried using 6 NON-HexLayers Tones. I couldn't figure out how to get the 6's volumes controlled individually by sliders 1 - 6.

When I got up to the 5th and 6th tones, TWO DIFFERENT sliders wound up controlling the volume of sound 5. (I'm assuming it has something to do with the fact that there is a max of 4 zones).

Mike, you said it COULD be done, but I can't figure out how to assign ONLY ONE slider to control the volume of sound 5 (or 6).

What am I doing wrong?

Again, here's what I want to do:

Slider 1: Sound 1, Zone 1

Slider 2: Sound 2, Zone 2

Slider 3: Sound 3, Zone 3

Slider 4: Sound 4, Zone 4

Slider 5: Sound 5, Zone 4

Slider 6: Sound 6, Zone 4

I want to control the volume of each of the 6 sounds INDEPENDENTLY by the 6 sliders.

Is this possible, or would there be a problem controlling the volume of sounds 4, 5 and 6 INDEPENDENTLY because they are all assigned to the same zone?

Every screen I saw had one of the four zones listed on the screen, so evidently any slider that controls a zone will control ANY sound that was set up using the same zone, as seen on the screen. Hope I'm describing the situation clearly. Thanks!

You would have to use Hex Layers. The PX-5S is a 4 zone instrument. That means 4 tones, not 6. Two of those zones can be more complex "Hex Layer" tones each having up to six layers each. Technically that's 14 layers at once.

As I said in my previous post the slider configuration you're suggesting is not possible. I gave you an example of a variation that would give you exactly what you want.

Once you've assigned the sliders to the specific controls you want, in each Zone there is a controllers section where you can determine if a Zone uses a specific knob/wheel or slider or not.

Example of you set Slider 1 to CC#11 expression, all 4 zones will respond to that one slider. Then you can use the controller on/off switches on each zone to determine if you want a specific zone to respond to that function.

[Mike Martin]

A clarification of my previous post.

Slider 1: Hex Layer 1, Zone 1

Slider 2: Hex Layer 2, Zone 1

Slider 3: Hex Layer 3, Zone 1

Slider 4: Sound 4, Zone 2

Slider 5: Sound 5, Zone 3

Slider 6: Sound 6, Zone 4

SonnyDaye, it would probably be best if we started a new topic. Maybe there you can explain exactly which six sounds you want at once.

[IM29]

Super excited, waiting for my new Px-5s to arrive this week. I'm wondering, is there a recommended gig bag for this keyboard?

 

Thanks!

[Mike Martin]

Casio makes a Privia gig bag. There are also great cases from Gator and others.