MIDIng keyboards via USB

[Synthesizr]

Apologies if this has been covered before (please quote URL if it has) or I am asking a daft question. A lot of modern keyboards only have USB MIDI sockets not 5pin DIN sockets. Is it still possible to drive one keyboard with another via MIDI, do both have to have USB MIDI, can you use a USB-to-DIN convertor? Thanks

[Null]

It can be done either by using your Computer as a MIDI router (lots of free software out there for that) or else paying big bux for a USB MIDI Host box.

 

http://midirouter.sourceforge.net/

 

http://jackaudio.org/jack_on_windows

 

http://www.kvraudio.com/product/midi-patchbay-by-soundigy

 

http://www.midiox.com/

 

(Click on MIDI Yoke)

 

or

 

http://www.kentonuk.com/products/items/utilities/usb-host.shtml

 

http://www.iconnectivity.com/iConnectMIDI

 

Also if yer handy with a soldering iron and programming embedded controllers you might want to take a look at the results of this google search.

 

https://www.google.ca/search?num=100&newwindow=1&site=&source=hp&q=raspberry+pi+as+midi+router&oq=raspberry+pi+as+midi+router&gs_l=hp.3..0i22i30.1506.10585.0.11032.28.24.0.4.4.0.357.5193.3j3j14j4.24.0....0...1c.1.42.hp..6.22.3875.0.D4f6C3IdDv0

[Synthesizr]

Aw that's a real backwards step for the keyboard industry to rely on a computer (which probably has to be Micro$oft Windoze). Makes it cheaper I suppose But many thanks for the reply anyway and the tip about the USB host box.

[Joe Muscara]

The keyboards that only have MIDI-over-USB weren't intended to connect to anything but a computer. For some people, that's all they need. For others, that's more than they need. For the rest, I guess you should move up a model and get the one with 5-pin MIDI DIN connectors.

[Jokeyman123]

Casio was smart enough to include "legacy" midi din connectors and USB with at least the PX-350 and XW-P1. I also found almost all modern keyboard controllers do not have these-I managed to find an older Alesis "A25" not the Q25 which has both usb and MIDI DIN ports with a hardware switch for using one or the other-one of the few models I could find that did in a 25-key controller. The A25 is no longer made, with practically no info on the web about these. Just another aspect of "dumbed-down" technology I suppose.

[Null]

Just as an FYI, there is MIDI routing software available for Mac and Linux as well.

 

Personally I'm using a mix of MIDI and USB devices with a Linux system running KXStudio under Kubuntu 13.10.

 

It uses a graphical patch board for the JACK interface and actually works quite well.

 

You could use a laptop as well if portability is an issue but I wouldn't recommend using a netbook since they are typically underpowered.

 

Gary

[Jokeyman123]

Hello happyrat downloading Kubuntu 13.10, will try it. I've used Lubuntu, Ubuntu 12 and several versions of Puppy, but haven't had too much fun configuring these for midi interfacing (drivers seem to be the weak point). My interest is re-kindled and will try this out. Never liked Windows much, it's slow, even 7 crashes constantly no matter how much house-keeping I do, it was never designed well for music, from Windows 3.1 to now. The prospect of upgrading to 8 just doesn't do it for me, I've tried it, I don't see much advantage to it except of course this where the major commercial players still seem to develop. And since the command line for all Linux is pretty much the same as Android, with ADB and terminal, why not. and although Puppy is much faster than the Ubuntu variations at least the way I use it, I guess Ubuntu is probably more useful on the music end, if only due to more advanced drivers (I think, I'll try it).

[Null]

After you install Kubuntu go to this site and follow directions to install KXStudio before you do anything else.

 

http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/

 

http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/Documentation:Repository:Upgrade

 

Ignore what they say about 12.04 Only.  It works fine for 13.10 with only a few warnings that don't affect performance.

 

BTW, even though I have worked with Rosegarden, I prefer to do my sequencing with Cakewalk Home Studio 9.01 for windows under wine.

 

Pretty much all the cakewalk MIDI products work well under wine.

 

Even the XW-P1 Data Editor works flawlessly under wine.  Though I've never had the guts to do a firmware update with wine

 

And latency is a thing of the past when you install the lowlatency kernel from the KXStudio repos.

[Null]

Also make certain you follow the last step and install the low latency kernel for your version.

[Jokeyman123]

OK, thanks Happyrat. will try it tonight. I'm shocked there is even a version of Reaper on this platform, other DAWs that I guess will work and midi sequencers, very nice. I use Reaper in Windows to render Roland VS "song data" files to wave/mp3 (I have on old VS-840GX I converted to CF card). I didn't like Rosegarden either. Surprised Wine works that well with Kubuntu, but good. Why so many different audio plug-ins, does it matter which one I install?  Evolving us away from the original topic, maybe I need to start a Linux/Casio topic! (Sorry synthesizr for hi-jacking your post, I'll stop after this.)  Amazed Casio editor works in Wine, a pleasant surprise. As you may guess, I'm afraid to do a firmware update with anything, I've left my XW with whatever is in there after it was repaired. It works, I'll leave it

[Null]

Reaper also works well under wine though I started out with Cakewalk 16 years ago and have stuck with it ever since.

 

As far as VSTi plugins go though, I have to give the windows ones a failing grade.  There is so much latency under the emulator they are 95% useless.

 

Maybe if I upgraded to 16 Gigs RAM and the latest Intel Xeon Server?

 

Also make sure one of the first programs you install is Synaptic.  The Muon Software updater and installers suck ass compared to good old Synaptic.

 

Gary

[Jokeyman123]

Just a quick addition to this post about USB only keyboards-I just bought another older midi controller (49-key this time, I need at least 49 so I have more possibiiities of hitting the right ones once in awhile) with a single DIN midi out connection and a 15-pin (!) soundcard connector-with the cable-how's that for old school. It's a Miditech "Midicontrol" with 12 programmable analog control knobs. I think I'll plug it into the XW and PX-350, start diddling the knobs around and see what happens (sounds obscene I know-sorry). Was going for a CZ-101 or other din midi small Casio, but almost impossible to find  and the CZs are way too many bucks on EBaby. There are a couple of CZ230s that looked interesting with midi DINs but that's about all. If I were even more crazy, I would think up a way to convert a USB out connection to a true midi din in/out without spending 200 bucks on a Kenton. There is a midi controller chip called a UART which is at the heart of a full midi in/out/thru port, with corresponding embedded code which is what the kenton probably is inside. USB and midi are both serial protocols but with different command sets so it gets pretty hairy if you want to roll and smoke yer own. It's about the money-it's cheaper to leave out the chipset and software and force us to use the computer to spit back a musical hairball instead of being consistent with connectors. I'm glad the Casios have both.