Auto accompaniment on PX350 - what were Casio thinking ?

[Whatani]

Just getting used to my PX350 and yes, the reviews are right - it's great value, it sounds good, it's half the weight of my Yamaha, it's got some nice features like line input, etc - BUT

 

Is it me, or does the auto accompaniment has a major flaw ?

 

I play lounge jazz/vocal using a (Yamaha) digital piano and a GEM accompaniment module which I strip back so that it only plays acoustic bass. Lets be honest, auto accompaniment generally is a bit tacky and awful so I never bothered with it until I realised that with just auto accompaniment acoustic bass and a hint of percussion the effect is really subtle, makes a huge difference to the sound and is a pleasure to play.

 

My plan was to change to a  PX350, which has auto accompaniment built in AND a line input for my mike, and simplify my whole setup - great, EXCEPT

 

Why on Earth does the PX350 play a new bass note the moment it detects a change in the current chord, even if a bass note is not due?? Can anyone help me with this because it's a total deal-breaker.

 

EG. if I set a pattern of say, 2 bass notes per bar at a slow tempo of say 50 BPM and hold a CMaj anywhere on the keyboard, the PX350 plays a C note and then a G note exactly when they are due. But if I change the chord at all, even from Maj to Minor, the PX350 triggers a new bass note instantly whether one is due or not, COMPLETELY RUINING THE RHYTHM.

 

You wouldn't do that with say, the snare drum, it would be a musical disaster, so why do it with the bass??

 

Casio PX350M, Jazz style rhythm (modified by me to play bass and percussion channels only), auto accompaniment, chord detection mode set to full range.

 

Someone please tell me that it's not going straight onto eBay.

[Jokeyman123]

Many auto-accompaniment keyboards have options for how to interpret the bass line-for implementing slash chords and varying the downbeats. Not the PX-350. Not that I can figure. The Gem instruments could do this (I played an SK76 for several years that was about the best I've ever found for this). Whatever bass line you created would be stored as a user accompaniment and you could program it any way you wanted as you probably already know. Too bad there are such limitations as in most other respects this is a very playable digital piano.

[Whatani]

Thanks Jokeyman123. Yes, on my GEM module I have to specify the source type as a digital piano (as opposed to an accordion, etc) which illustrates the serious nature of the module. The chord recognition on the Casio is a bit flawed also, if I hold the chord Eb, G, Bb and C, the Casio interprets this as a Cmin chord unless I also hold the Eb note an octave below. It's a real pity because if the Casio software was better this would be a great instrument for me. They've even omitted the option to stop/start the accompaniment from a footpedal, which is basic stuff surely. Roland make one, except that it's 3 times the price and 3 times the weight !

 

I have a wedding gig on Friday but think I'll be using the old Yamaha P60 to be safe. I've totally hammered it over the years and it shows it but still functions as new :-)

[Brad Saucier]

Make sure you have the proper chord mode selected.  Check the chord guide here.  Each one features different chord detection.  

 

http://support.casio.com/storage/en/manual/pdf/EN/008/PX350M_EN.pdf#page=74

 

Also, have you tried other rhythms for the bass line?  That particular Jazz rhythm is designed for bass to retrigger on each chord change.  It's part of that style of music. Other rhythms should not retrigger bass at chord changes.  

As far as the pedal starting/stopping accomp...that feature is available on Casio's workstation models like the WK-7600.  

[Whatani]

Hi BradMZ, thanks.


I have full range chord mode selected, the other modes limit playing style too much for serious use and still trigger unwanted bass notes..


"That particular Jazz rhythm is designed for bass to retrigger on each chord change.  It's part of that style of music. Other rhythms should not retrigger bass at chord changes."

Really? I just went through dozens of rhythms in different groups, Latin, Ballad, World, Pop, all of which trigger new bass notes the moment a chord change is detected. Surely there are few, if any circumstances or music styles in which you would want a bass note to trigger outside of the rhythm, any more than you would want a drum beat every time a chord change was detected. It turns a pianist into a bass player.


My 20+ year old Technics home piano doesn't do it, a piano I played in a restaurant for some years didn't do it, my GEM module doesn't do it, a new hernia inducing Roland piano I tried at the weekend didn't do it either, and why would they.

 

Wouldn't a simple tweak in the Casio software solve this? set the bass channel to read the chord but, like the percussion, only trigger if a note is due?  If I hold the notes Middle C and G and then trill slowly between the next C and F above, I can trigger 15 or 20 bass notes per bar, rather like a demented bass player on speed.

 

Casio justifiably have pride in the PX 350 and seem to have gone to so great lengths with many elements of the piano to produce a fine instrument. It's a great pity IMHO that the auto accompaniment didn't spend a bit more time in the oven. If you don't agree, try playing an old Technics ensemble or the new Roland FP-80.

 

Thanks BradMZ