Odd volumes

[maarkr]

OK, backed up the XP before I do a firmware update, and messing with a couple of performances.  Odd thing... When I tried to adjust the volume of track 2, I noticed the volume level indicator of track one followed it as I adjusted it??? then I went to a different perf, and tried to adjust the volume of track 2... it seemed to adjust independent of track 1, but when I saved it, the volume reverted to the same as track 1. Did I do something to affect these volume adjustments?

 

Edit:  Apparently using a computer with Win 8.1 for updating firmware or using the data editor causes issues.  I guess they are reviewing and updating software for Win 8.1.  After I updated to the 1.11 firmware on my Win 7 machine, things worked fine.

[maarkr]

Well, it's not fixed.  The other day, I was trying to build a new performance, and I put a tone in the first zone, then added a different tone in the second zone.  I tried to adjust the first zone to a volume of 40 and the second one to 127.  I saved  the performance and noticed on playback the volume on both were equal.  I went back and tried adjusting the first one to 127 and the second to 40, saved it, and the same thing... both volumes went to 40.  Am I missing something basic?

[AlenK]

I just tried this on my XW-P1 with V1.10 firmware (I have not yet updated). No problems. The saved performance retains the individual volme settings for the zones. Did I understand correctly that you saw this both before and after the update?

[maarkr]

I noticed it first with v 1.10 and after loading some patches with the data editor.  I later updated to v 1.11 (using Win 7) and thought it was no longer a problem but later confirmed the volumes remained the same.  Maybe I should try to uninstall the patches I loaded.  Is there any known malware that affects any functions on the XW?  I just went downstairs to verify this again.  Both zones playing at volume 127.  Edit zone 2.  Lower volume to 63.  Volume LEDs show zone 2 lowering to half way down OK.  Write the performance... and both zones play at 127.  Go back into edit of zone 2, and it shows 127.

[Gnomo Alegre]

Hello and you welcome:

I think you have enabled DSP in zones 2, 3, or 4. You disable the DSP in these areas to a separate volume for each zone.

 

Edited November 20, 2013 by DAVID

[maarkr]

OK then, can someone explain how I can add a tone in Zone 2, edit the DSP to a dist tone 1, then save the perf keeping the volumes where I set them?  I looked in the book and there's not much on the DSP line, but I noticed to use a DSP you need to turn the DSP line on.  How this changes the volumes on the two zones I'd love to know for future reference.  Do I need to edit the tone in zone 2 as a new tone after adjusting the DSP the way I want, then add this new tone to zone 2 in a perf without DSP line enabled???

[AlenK]

Hi Gene,

 

Can we assume from your answer that you did indeed find that having DSP set to "on" for the zones was causing the problem?

 

I suspect that what is happening here is that since there is only one insert (DSP) effect, when you have DSP turned on for two or more zones (parts) they are all summed BEFORE input to the effect, whereas the volume control for the zone/part is POST effect. This does make a certain sense when you consider that all the DSP effects are mono-in (a few provide stereo out) and that none have a true wet/dry mix parameter (although delay does have "wet level"). It's not ideal behavior but maybe it's how the XW has been designed (among other weird and wacky choices that have come out of the design team in Japan).

 

As you know the manual describes how to use effects and the various rules VERY poorly. The diagram it provides on page E-37 showing how the effects block are arranged is actually wrong and the "Chorus and DSP Use Restictions" table is obtuse and doesn't address every possibility.

 

Mike Martin has previously explained that the DSP effect for zone 1 has precedence if you have, say, tones in more than one zone called up that each use a "normal" DSP effect. But what happens if the tone in zone 1 doesn't use a normal DSP effect but the tones in zones 2, 3 and 4 do? Which one's DSP effect actually gets used? The manual doesn't say.

[XW-Addict]

Hi Gene,

 

Can we assume from your answer that you did indeed find that having DSP set to "on" for the zones was causing the problem?

 

I Mike Martin has previously explained that the DSP effect for zone 1 has precedence if you have, say, tones in more than one zone called up that each use a "normal" DSP effect. But what happens if the tone in zone 1 doesn't use a normal DSP effect but the tones in zones 2, 3 and 4 do? Which one's DSP effect actually gets used? The manual doesn't say.

I've tried that out DSP is the main and only DSP, 

I guess this also means you've got one DSP over all these zones.

 

If you select all zones, You'll get one DSP effect on all these zones,

And If one zone is selected for DSP and you don't want that for the others

that leaves the reverb level to be set for each zone to set.

 

While also in Performance mode the solo synth  gets the soul usage

of the DSP over all the zones keeps the DSP for itself meaning you

only get reverb for the remaining zones and no DSP at all.

 

Its handy to keep that in mind while designing a new performance patch.

EQ falls over the whole patch. But its possible to create 3 off the same 

performance patch with the DSP set on those specific zones you want

and switch over these on the fly using the multi-function key in performance

mode. 

[maarkr]

yes, the DSP line was ON for zone 2.  Once I moved the tone with the DSP for zone 2 to zone 1, the issue was solved... and thank you alenk for agreeing that the manual is not clear in the description of using DSP.  I read this stuff five times before asking questions cause I don't want to waste time, and I try to keep up with all of the forum posts to learn about programming, but I'm sure i've missed many that may be pertinent.

Does this explain all there is with using DSP on the XW?  no   Does the manual explain it in detail? no  Does the forum help in understanding DSP?  yes, but in little bits at a time.