XpoiZone Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 Hello all. Last year I was very interested in buying a Casio PX-5s as my master keyboard. However because I was uncertain about it's capabilities to play lead sounds (especially not having mono mode), I bought the Yamaha MOXF instead. There was an element of sacrifice because I felt the PX-5s did a lot of things better than the MOXF did. I noticed that the PX-560 has been released. However, there is barely any information and only a couple of standard demos out there. The 560 to me seemed very similar to Korg's old M-50 / Korg's Krome keyboards. I'd like to know the main differences between the PX-5s and the PX-560. I play a lot of Progressive Rock/Progressive Metal on my keyboard and hence do require powerful lead sounds, especially ones that can have a WAH effect assigned to the mod wheel. Please advise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Display Name Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 Well first of all there is no "solo synth" mode (monophonic lead synth) on either the PX-5S or PX-560. Not that they can't do huge, thick lead sounds, but you won't be able to do the "tricks" you can do with a synth with mono mode like the XW-P1 or XW-G1. Now with that settled, some key differences:- PX-560 has a color touchscreen like a smartphone- PX-560 has an expression pedal input- PX-560 has dedicated transpose buttons- PX-560 has a sheet music holder- PX-560 has a multi-track MIDI song recorder, backing drums and accompaniment. The PX-5S remains a more capable MIDI controller and sound design synth. Both are great, it just depends on your wants and needs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XpoiZone Posted October 27, 2015 Author Share Posted October 27, 2015 Dear Scott, Can either be used as an audio interface? For example - connecting them to my PC and then connecting my headset to the keyboard to get the audio from both devices through the output. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 No. They cannot act as an "audio interface". They cannot act as D/A or A/D converters. If your computer already has an audio interface (built in or external) you can run the audio lines into the keyboard from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Display Name Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 What Brad said. So if, for example, you wanted to layer a sound from a synth on your PC with the PX-5S / PX-560 piano sound, you can easily do that. PC ---> Audio / line in of the PX-5S ---> Headphones (all will be mixed) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anotherscott Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 I felt the PX-5s did a lot of things better than the MOXF did. I'm curious, what did you think the PX5S did better than the MOXF? Anyway, in addition to what the other Scott said in post #2, the PX5S also still has some other advantages over the PX560:* four arpeggiators on the PX5S vs. one on the PX560* you can have up to three split points on the PX5s, vs. one on the PX560* while either can allow you to play up to four sounds at once, I believe the PX5S lets you put individual (as opposed to global) effects on each of the four sounds, whereas I think the PX560 only lets you put individual effects on one of the sounds* the PX5S provides ten buttons for instant custom patch recall, the PX560 provides only four (the total number of custom "stage settings" or "registrations" is about the same, 100 vs. 96, but the number of them available at any given moment with a single button press is 10 vs. 4)* the PX5S has 4 knobs and 6 sliders for manipulating the sound, the PX560 has 3 knobs and no sliders* PX5S is a few lbs lighter and of course an obvious advantage of the PX560 that he didn't list is that it has speakers. It also has more builtin tones, 670 vs. 350. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Muscara Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 * while either can allow you to play up to four sounds at once, I believe the PX5S lets you put individual (as opposed to global) effects on each of the four sounds, whereas I think the PX560 only lets you put individual effects on one of the soundsI could be misunderstanding what you wrote Scott, so apologies in advance if I am. I haven't used the PX-560 yet, but I am pretty familiar with the CGP-700 which has a similar architecture. On the 700, you can route any of the four sounds to one of three effect types (chorus, reverb, delay) and each can send a different amount. So, one of the sounds can have delay, another reverb, another chorus. I'm presuming the 560 is the same or similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anotherscott Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 I could be misunderstanding what you wrote Scott, so apologies in advance if I am. I haven't used the PX-560 yet, but I am pretty familiar with the CGP-700 which has a similar architecture. On the 700, you can route any of the four sounds to one of three effect types (chorus, reverb, delay) and each can send a different amount. So, one of the sounds can have delay, another reverb, another chorus. I'm presuming the 560 is the same or similar. It is a bit confusing. Chorus, delay, and reverb are available as what Casio calls "common" or "system" effects (not sure why they use two different terms). Yes, you can vary the amounts of each of these three things on a per-part basis, which is cool, but they are still shared effects (and only a small number of such effects are available).Apart from these effects, though, the PX-560 also has twenty "DSP effects" (which include additional delay/reverb/chorus effects and many others like distortion, phaser, rotary, wah, etc.). These correspond to what most boards call "insert" effects, all of their settings can be unique to each part. On the PX5S, I believe every one of the four parts can have its own DSP effect enabled. But on the PX560, the manual says "When tones with DSP are assigned as both the main tone and the layered tone, the effect of one of the tones becomes disabled." (And same for split.) So let's say you want to split, for example, an organ-with-rotary effect and a rhodes-with-auto-pan effect. As I read it, you can do this on the PX-5S, but not the PX-560. edit: Here's another way to look at it. If you have a mixing board with an Effects Send that goes to a master Delay, you can put a different amount of that delay on each channel, but it's always the same delay. If you want to put a different delay or some entirely different effect on just one instrument, you would typically wire that effect into the mixing board's Insert jacks (which is where the idea of "insert" effects comes from). So the PX560 seems to operate kind of like a mixer where each channel has an effect send for reverb, another one for delay, and another for chorus, but also has jacks for putting a specific effect on just one channel... with the limitation that you can only do it on one channel, versus on the PX5S where I think you can do it on up to four channels (each "channel" in this analogy representing one split or layered sound). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Muscara Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 Cleared that right up! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 Yes he did. I could not have explained it better myself. A side note, I think the PX-560 has 2 DSP inserts. One is dedicated to the performance tones and the other to the accomp rhythm patterns and/or the midi recorder. I think. This is what I gather from the effects block diagram in the PDF manual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XpoiZone Posted November 2, 2015 Author Share Posted November 2, 2015 I'm curious, what did you think the PX5S did better than the MOXF? Well I'm comparing the moxf6 (61 key) directly to the PX-5s which are within a couple hundred dollars in price. The PX-5s-Has 88 keys with some good action.-Has better grand piano sound (though I use synthology ivory anyway so it doesn't really matter).-Has 4 knobs and 6 sliders while the moxf has 8 knobs. Sliders are better than knobs, though in this case only barely due to the small size on the PX-5s. Another thing is that the PX-5s synth engine always comes out to sound better than the synth sounds on the MOXF. I believe you can only layer a sound 4 times in performance mode on the MOXF. In general, the synths on the moxf sound so canned and from the 80s compared to the PX-5s. This could also be due to my lack of in depth knowledge about the keyboard. Mostly the issue is that I'm stuck at this price point without any extra capital (if I am to get a PX-5s I must sell my MOXF6). I always thought I could save a few hundred and just buy a low end privia to act as my controller for the moxf but the lack of real time control options on it just cripple my plans. Not to mention all of my money goes into tuition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anotherscott Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 Well I'm comparing the moxf6 (61 key) directly to the PX-5s which are within a couple hundred dollars in price. The PX-5s-Has 88 keys with some good action.-Has better grand piano sound (though I use synthology ivory anyway so it doesn't really matter).-Has 4 knobs and 6 sliders while the moxf has 8 knobs. Sliders are better than knobs, though in this case only barely due to the small size on the PX-5s. Another thing is that the PX-5s synth engine always comes out to sound better than the synth sounds on the MOXF. I believe you can only layer a sound 4 times in performance mode on the MOXF. In general, the synths on the moxf sound so canned and from the 80s compared to the PX-5s. This could also be due to my lack of in depth knowledge about the keyboard. Mostly the issue is that I'm stuck at this price point without any extra capital (if I am to get a PX-5s I must sell my MOXF6). I always thought I could save a few hundred and just buy a low end privia to act as my controller for the moxf but the lack of real time control options on it just cripple my plans. Not to mention all of my money goes into tuition. Well, of course sounds are somewhat subjective. But in terms of piano sound, another option the MOXF gives you is, if you add their flash card, there are a number of additional, completely different piano sounds you can load into it (i.e. using samples from different pianos), including a bunch of free ones supplied by Yamaha. In terms of real-time control, one thing to consider on the MOXF is that the 8 knobs can each be switched in real-time to multiple functions (by using the Knob Function buttons to the left of the knobs themselves), so there are a greater number of immediately modifiable parameters than the number of controls at first indicates. (Plus there is also the pair of Assignable Function buttons and the Expression Pedal input.) Synth engines, again, sounds are subjective, but one Yamaha advantage there is that they have a mono synth mode, PX5S does not. (Though if you're using Ivory for piano, you can presumably add a soft-synth for additional synth functionality as well.) You are correct that Yamaha Performance mode only lets you layer 4 sounds, but Casio's zones also are set up that way. While Casio does allow two of those 4 sounds to, themselves, be a combination of 6 sounds (hexlayer), if you get into it, you can do some similar things in the Yamaha, since each of its sounds can consist of up to 8 elements (that's why, for example, a single Yamaha sound can still be a piano+strings layer). Yamaha also has Song/Pattern Mix mode which lets you layer up to 16 sounds. I think a MOXF6 and a PX5S is a great combination, and one that I've gigged with quite a bit (well actually, the older MOX6). But yeah, I realize economics doesn't give everyone that luxury. If I had to choose just one? That's a tough one. Overall, personally, I tend to prefer the Yamaha's sounds, its interface/screen/ergonomics, and its additional functionality. But yes, there are places where Casio has the edge, and if you do a lot of piano-centric stuff, the 61 Yamaha keys and their non-piano-friendly action would be a real limitation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XpoiZone Posted November 3, 2015 Author Share Posted November 3, 2015 You make a good point. They're both quite different in terms of strengths. I just feel a little let down by the MOXF's synth engine. It's true that I'm a novice at programming sounds, but I've already realized there are no sub oscillators (not that big of a deal) and no unison mode to stack synth leads. I tried recreating Jordan Rudess' amazing lead sounds in the editor and failed miserably. It's quite frustrating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anotherscott Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 You make a good point. They're both quite different in terms of strengths. I just feel a little let down by the MOXF's synth engine. It's true that I'm a novice at programming sounds, but I've already realized there are no sub oscillators (not that big of a deal) and no unison mode to stack synth leads. I tried recreating Jordan Rudess' amazing lead sounds in the editor and failed miserably. It's quite frustrating. I have a feeling you'd be equally let down by the lead synth functionality of the PX5S, maybe even more so, with the lack of any mono mode at all. Rather than think about getting rid of your MOX6 for a PX5S, if synth is the big area you're trying to address, maybe you could keep the MOX6 and add a less expensive more "synth" oriented Casio like the XW-P1 or XW-G1. (The G1 has more real-time synth controls; the P1 has some semblance of drawbar organ which is another area where the MOXF6 is weak, so either could be a nice complement to the Yamaha.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XpoiZone Posted November 3, 2015 Author Share Posted November 3, 2015 I considered that. Unfortunately it would leave me with nothing that has 88 keys. I've heard that Jordan's app Jordantron has all of his live sounds (hopefully including the leads) so I was wondering if I could group that with the PX-5s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anotherscott Posted November 4, 2015 Share Posted November 4, 2015 I considered that. Unfortunately it would leave me with nothing that has 88 keys. I've heard that Jordan's app Jordantron has all of his live sounds (hopefully including the leads) so I was wondering if I could group that with the PX-5s.That should work fine. For that matter, you could also drive it from your existing MOXF6, at least to try it out, even if you ultimately want the PX5S for things like its 88 keys and sliders. No matter what, I think there's a trade-off. I think the PX5S keys are kind of heavy for doing Jordan-style lead work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tkarl Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 I'm curious, what did you think the PX5S did better than the MOXF? Anyway, in addition to what the other Scott said in post #2, the PX5S also still has some other advantages over the PX560:* four arpeggiators on the PX5S vs. one on the PX560 I'm new to this so bear with me ... I just checked the pdf of the PX-560, and I found that there were 100 types of arpeggiators listed in the Appendix. I'm not sure if this trumps the four in the px-5s or it's apples & oranges. Please clarify. I was building a spreadsheet to compare the two myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anotherscott Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 I'm new to this so bear with me ... I just checked the pdf of the PX-560, and I found that there were 100 types of arpeggiators listed in the Appendix. I'm not sure if this trumps the four in the px-5s or it's apples & oranges. Please clarify. I was building a spreadsheet to compare the two myself.The 560 has one arpeggiator, with 100 selectable presets. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tkarl Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 The 560 has one arpeggiator, with 100 selectable presets.How important is it to have more than one Arpeggiator? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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