73/76 weighted key

[reed]

I hope that Casio will develop 73/76 key digital piano.   I almost purchased Numa X 73, but no built in speaker is a deal breaker for me. 

[Jokeyman123]

I think it is an unfortunate omission that many manufacturers no longer produce 76 key piano action-weighted instruments or controllers. The last ones I owned were the Ensoniq series-the KS-32, TS-12 and MR-76 all have weighted keys but no built-in speakers, and use the older fatar TP-10 key action, which I found a bit noisier than newer 88-key designed Fatars and the Casios. I think Studiologic or Fatar made older 76-key weighted instruments-but were only controllers as i recall and were also pretty heavy to carry.

 

What is particularly annoying to me at least-when these so-called "reviews" from independent sources describe a keyboard as 'weighted" when in fact whatever they are describing is not weighted at all. The Numa as you said, seems to be the only one I can find. And it uses A Fatar TP-110-like my Fusion TP-40 Fatar, which in my opinion, tis he best hammer action keyboard I've ever played short of a real grand but is designed with-88 keys and weighs a ton! Glad you brought this up-I never noticed the Numa, this looks like a killer keyboard for what it is but I like the PX-560 too much to invest in another hammer-action board. it just fits sideways in my car, so I'm happy with that. I doubt Casio will make a 76-key piano-action board-would require a complete re-design of their existing weighted instruments. had the WK series come with truly 'weighted" piano action keys, I would have kept mine although for an unweighted design, i actually find the Casio actions very playable even though I am more of a pianoman than a Hammond man. Billy Joel, and Joey DeFrancesco, etc. have nothing to worry about though.......🤣 Weird Al Yankovic might want to be careful-I grew up playing in more than one polka gig, the real ones.......i do live in Pennsylvania where we still have the Polka channel on TV. some d*** good musicians in those bands by the way!

[reed]

I am too spoiled by all the Casio boards with built-in speakers that I have owned.   If Casio doesn't make a 73/76 in the near future and I really need one, I will consider the Yamaha P121 with 73 key.

[Jokeyman123]

P121 with GHS action-hmm, looks interesting. Graded, weighted keys, 22 pounds, not bad. I wonder if the Numa is using the same Yamaha GHS action, although I think the Numas use Fatar.

[anotherscott]

On 5/16/2022 at 9:12 AM, Jokeyman123 said:

The Numa as you said, seems to be the only one I can find. And it uses A Fatar TP-110-like my Fusion TP-40 Fatar

TP-110 is entirely different from the TP-40 series.

 

But there are other 7x-key hammer action boards around.

Korg SV2 uses Korg's RH3 action, also used in the recently discontinued 73 key versions of the Grandstage and Kronos.

Yamaha has the P121 already mentioned (GHS action), and also the CP73 and YC73, which use BHS (balanced rather than graded versions of the P121's action).

Dexibell uses the Fatar TP-100 in the S3 Pro (and in the older S3 and P3).

Kurzweil Forte 7 uses Fatar TP-40L (the lightest feeling of the TP40 actions).

Nord uses the Fatar TP-100 in the 73 key HP versions of the Electro 6 and 76 key version of the Nord Stage 3; they use a version of the TP-40 in the 73- key version of the Nord Piano 5.

 

15 hours ago, Jokeyman123 said:

P121 with GHS action-hmm, looks interesting. Graded, weighted keys, 22 pounds, not bad. I wonder if the Numa is using the same Yamaha GHS action, although I think the Numas use Fatar.

Numa uses Fatar. It's actually the same company, so they use their own actions.

[Jokeyman123]

How is the TP-110 entirely different. I've read all so many posts re key actions for years, I won't open this can of worms here. but anotherscott if you can find a picture of the TP-110110 mechanism, I'd like to see it if you can find it. The latest I can find is for the TP-100...and if the 110 is similar, yes it certainly is entirely different than a TP-40.

 

http://www.fatar.com/Pages/TP100LR.html

 

Which honestly-looks cheaper and less sturdy than the older TP-40.  I know all manufacturers are going with more plastic to lighten the weight-but....there is no free lunch, you gain something here, lose it elsewhere. And Fatar-well read my posts in the Alesis music group if you want an earful, despite that I've kept my fusions but this is a Casio forum I'll say no more.

 

And my old Korg SP-500-is a Fatar, even though called it the Korg RH-2!  I know, I've disassembled that one too. it's graded, the design is a TP-40. Makes me want to go back to playing-a harmonica or kazoo.

 

And reed, I guess the point to all this-I would play first whatever you are going to buy if it is physically possible. The way it feels to you is all that matters ultimately. 

Edited May 23, 2022 by Jokeyman123

[Jokeyman123]

Anotherscott-glad you posted.

[reed]

6 hours ago, Jokeyman123 said:

How is the TP-110 entirely different. I've read all so many posts re key actions for years, I won't open this can of worms here. but anotherscott if you can find a picture of the TP-110110 mechanism, I'd like to see it if you can find it. The latest I can find is for the TP-100...and if the 110 is similar, yes it certainly is entirely different than a TP-40.

 

And reed, I guess the point to all this-I would play first whatever you are going to buy if it is physically possible. The way it feels to you is all that matters ultimately. 

I rely upon reviews and comments online for most of my purchasing as I live in a small city.  You just have to read a lot to come to your own conclusion.     Here's some info on the TP110 but it is all in Italian. 

https://www.smstrumentimusicali.it/speciale-studiologic-numa-x-piano/

 

 

 

 

[Jokeyman123]

Yes i saw this, but it didn't help much! Anotherscott-very knowledgeable in this area. Scour the Music Player boards, Yamaha Musicians., Korg boards, anything you can find-but you will see-there are as many opinions as stars in the sky when it comes to piano feel. some people love GHS, some hate it. also look for Pianomanchucks demos-which isn't strictly Casio. Some love RH2/3 and its variations, others no, etc. ad infinitum! Somewhere here I had posted the most comprehensive database there is online that documented a tremendous amount of data regarding every conceivable and measurable detail about dozens of weighted key controllers and workstations including the casios, korgs, yamahas, studiologics, Dexibell and several others . If I can find my bookmark, I'll re-post it here. It shows throw-weights, key lengths, downweight, rebound weight and several other measurements, comparing many acoustic pianos and comparable weighted workstations and controllers. I think it was in one of the Yamaha or Korg user groups, anotherscott know.

Edited May 23, 2022 by Jokeyman123

[Pravito]

So far, there were only 73 key weighted keyboards, such as Yamaha P121 and CP73. I have never seen weighted 76 yet

[Pravito]

On 5/24/2022 at 4:09 AM, Jokeyman123 said:

Yes i saw this, but it didn't help much! Anotherscott-very knowledgeable in this area. Scour the Music Player boards, Yamaha Musicians., Korg boards, anything you can find-but you will see-there are as many opinions as stars in the sky when it comes to piano feel. some people love GHS, some hate it. also look for Pianomanchucks demos-which isn't strictly Casio. Some love RH2/3 and its variations, others no, etc. ad infinitum! Somewhere here I had posted the most comprehensive database there is online that documented a tremendous amount of data regarding every conceivable and measurable detail about dozens of weighted key controllers and workstations including the casios, korgs, yamahas, studiologics, Dexibell and several others . If I can find my bookmark, I'll re-post it here. It shows throw-weights, key lengths, downweight, rebound weight and several other measurements, comparing many acoustic pianos and comparable weighted workstations and controllers. I think it was in one of the Yamaha or Korg user groups, anotherscott know.

 

Yamaha GHS is somehow inferior to Tri-sensor Scaled Hammer Action in most Privia models, but it feels just right. The weight is more similar to that of Kawai upright pianos, whereas Casio's Scaled Hammer Action is more identical in weight to the Yamaha C-series grand pianos