16 channels on data editor

[Hugh O Kelly]

What are the 16 channels for in data editor.?

I know what the first four are

 

 

 

Either I have a very intelligent question

or very dumb one

because no one will tell me !

 

HELP !

[Choppin]

Not sure if I understand the question and unfortunately I am not in front of my Px-5s or a computer with the editor running, but, there are 16 parts in the PX-5s.  In general, the 16 parts corespond to 16 midi channels.  Parts 1 through 4 are assigned to the 4 zones that are playable through the keyboard.  Parts 5-16 are generally assigned to song tracks as midi channels 5-16.  While any part, per se, can be assigned any midi channel, this is the basic layout.

 

Try playing a midi file from the usb drive while you have the editor mixer open.  See if you can control the mix of the midi playback live through the editor as the file is playing.  Otherwise, I imagine the parts are defaults for the song sequencer settings.

[Hugh O Kelly]

Thanks  Choppin,

 

Although I have tried to access midi channels 5,6, and 7, I can't.

 

So my next question would be

 

How to you access midi channels 5,6, and 7 while playing 1,2,3,4, on the ps5.

 

I don't really understand the "parts"5-16.

I do understand how one channel can be made up of different parts as i.e. the drums with different drums on different midi notes on the same channel.

If you could unravel the concept I would be delighted.

Good news is I love the ps5 and am getting on well with the rest of it

Thanks again  

[Brad Saucier]

What do you mean by "access" channels 5.6 and 7 while playing 1,2,3,and 4?  The only on-board way to utilize channels outside of 1 thru 4 is by playing a midi file from the usb or a playing a song sequence.  Zones 1-4 will always use channels 1-4.   

[Hugh O Kelly]

What I was hoping is that while I had all four midi channels 1-4 playing live on the

 PX-5s

 

 

is that I could change program and it calls up say channel 5,6,7,8 (no sound on PX-5s) so I can have sounds from different modules 

 

and then go back to my other program midi 1,2,3,4

(playing live that is)

 

I hope I am being clear   ( yea! clear as dish water )

[Choppin]

Hi Hugh,

 

Had a chance to test it.  If I play a midi file from the usb drive directly on the Px-5s, I can use the mixer in the Editor to control the mix of the midi music live.  I tired it with a song playing from the song sequencer, and I can control that mix too.  So the answer to the first part of your question: "What are the 16 channels for in data editor.?" it seems to be the mixer settings for midi playback.

 

To maybe elaborate a little on what Brad was saying:

 

There's three concepts here that we have to keep separate:

Zones

Parts (I will use the terms 'parts' and 'tracks' interchangeably)

Midi Channels

 

Zones are the playable areas on the keyboard.  When you press a key, a single zone or a combination of up to 4 zones sound at once.  Within a zone, you'll have your tone(s) and settings to shape that tone.  The 4 zones change according to stage settings.  A single stage setting will be some combination of the 4 zones: all or some set to play.

 

There are 16 parts.  The 16 parts can be thought of as tracks.  The first 4 parts (tracks) are reserved for the 4 zones.  Zone 1 is on track 1, zone 2 is on track 2, zone 3 is on track 3, and zone 4 is on track 4.  Because the 4 zones are tied directly to the keys you press for any given stage setting, tracks 1 through 4 can be played directly on the keyboard and the output of this playing can be sent to midi channels.

 

Midi Channels are just that - the channels midi data is sent on.  I just want to make sure that we are identifying these as completely separate from zones and parts.  Back to the 16 parts; the 16 parts of the px-5s are for midi playback.  This playback is achieved by either playing a midi file through the usb drive, playing a song from the built in song sequencer, or playing a song through an external sequencer connected to the px-5s via midi cables or the usb cable.

 

Any part can be assigned any channel.  I'll repeat that: any part can be assigned any channel.  Parts 1-4 are assigned to midi channels 1-4 by default, but they can be changed via stage settings or when building a song in the song sequencer.  The basic function of the parts is for midi playback - when the px-5s is acting as a slave to a sequencer or midi file.  However, when in performance, you rely on parts 1-4 for control and playback on an external device.  So whatever channel you have these parts set to, is the channel that will be received by an external device when you play the keyboard. 

 

Now, there is a tricky bit to this regarding receiving midi data.  When the px-5s receives midi data to play, if it receives standard programs changes on bank 0, it will change the tones corresponding to the program changes in the midi data.  If the midi data received is standard GM, then the tones chosen on the px-5s will be standard GM.  This will work for all 16 parts.  If, however, the PX-5s receives a bank select code of 112 (decimal) and MSB of 36 (decimal), then the program change will be an entire stage setting.  If the stage setting is called up then the midi channels that are set on the stage setting start listening and will play back any information sent to them.  This affects parts 1-4 only.  Since parts 5-16 do not correspond to any zones or stage settings, they cannot be accessed through this type of program change.

 

To sum up:

There are 16 parts.

Parts 1-4 are assigned to zones 1-4

Any part can be set to any midi channel.

All 16 parts can be played by a sequencer (internal or external) or by a midi file plugged into the usb drive port.

Only parts 1-4 can control an external device and only when the keyboard is physically played - not through the sequencer (I think)

[Hugh O Kelly]

Choppin,

 

Firstly may I thank you for the very comprehensive and detailed help you have given me.

 

The donkey understood every word ,as for me ?

 

Seriously I got most of it        (  I've got 27 A levels , 9 MA's and never told a lie in my life )

 

So using the PX-5s live on a gig I can only control my external midi on 4 channels.  ?

 

In practical terms I would say have the hammond permanently on midi 5 and 6( bass and lower keyboard ) and have another two channels on say 7 and 8

for the muse box

So one stage setting would be midi channel 1-4  PX-5s only

and the next stage setting would be all external sounds only ( hammond,muse box,whatever )

 

From what i gathered I can't do that 

Is that right Choppin ( or may I call you Frederick ! )

I like the one in Eb !

 

ALL THE BEST

Hugh

[Choppin]

Hi Hugh,

 

Sometimes I tend to be little long winded (I must love to hear myself talk!) so I apologize if I ramble a bit.

 

Let's say you have 2 stage settings, we'll say 0-0 and 0-1.  You could have the 4 zones in stage setting 0-0 set to midi channels 1,2,3 and 4 .   In 0-1 you could have the 4 zones set to midi channels 5,6,7,8 for example.  When you switch between 0-0 and 0-1, you will control the midi channels assigned to that stage setting. 

 

You could also overlap midi channels if you want.  It doesn't have to be in sequence.  So in stage setting 0-0 you could have midi channels 1,2,3,4 for instance, and in 0-1 you could have 5,6,3,4 so you could continue to play what ever external sound is on midi channels 3,4 when you switch stage settings.

 

Live, you can control 4 midi channels when you play the px-5s; any 4 midi channels you want assigned to any of the 4 zones in the stage setting.

 

Remember, 'parts' are the tracks that the px-5s can play back midi data on - not transmit.  The px-5s is not a full on sequencer so therefore it won't control other devices using the built in song sequencer  The px-5s has 16 tracks and will play midi information coming into it on these tracks on whatever channel these tracks are assigned.  It seems like tracks (parts) 1-4  are the exception, but the way I look at it it's not.

 

Parts 1-4 do not transmit midi data but rather ZONES 1-4 transmit midi data.  In the previous post I tried to distinguish between parts (tracks), zones and channels.  Parts always play back stored or received midi data.  The advantage parts 1-4 have in being assigned zones is that you can use the stage settings to control the sounds on those tracks.

 

After all that, here's the main idea:

1. Whatever midi channel you have assigned to a zone in a stage setting will control an external midi device when you physically play the keyboard.

2. You can set your stage settings up to have different midi channels on different zones

3. Just an extra note - you don't have to use the px-5s sound generator when you are controlling other devices

4. The 16 parts are for midi playback while parts 1-4 allow you control over the sound through stage settings.

5. Stage settings can be selected by midi data through program change 112(dec), 36(dec), stage setting number.

 

I'm no expert so this summation may be flawed, but after reading and experimenting, this is what I come up with.

[Hugh O Kelly]

Dear Choppin,

 

Don't  apologise,its me who is slow.

Right,

'1. Whatever midi channel you have assigned to a zone in a stage setting will control an external midi device when you physically play the keyboard.

2. You can set your stage settings up to have different midi channels on different zones'

 

So I'm playing live

Stage setting 0,0 is sending out on midi 1,2,3 and 4

How do I get  Stage setting 0,1 to send out on midi channel say 5,6,7 and 8, ten seconds later go back to Stage setting 0,0

ie to have different midi channels for the stage settings .

What do I do?

How do I program it,in what window on the px-5s

Thanks again for your patience ….I think we're nearly there       

[Choppin]

Ok,

 

1. Choose your stage setting

2. Press [Edit]

3. Follow these menu prompts.  > means press enter after the menu item

Cursor up is the Number 7 key

Cursor Down is the Number 6 key

 

Stage Settings > Zone Edit > Cursor Down, Cursor Down, MIDI Edit >

 

In the display window in the upper right corner, you will see 'Z1 .  This means that you are currently managing the settings for  Zone 1.  You can change the Zone by using the + and - keys to the left of the little display window that have the title "Zone/Part/Step/Track"

 

Choose your zone (Z1, Z2, Z3, or Z4)

 

In the window, cursor down to External Out Ch

 

Use Knob K2 to dial in the channel you want to set this zone to.

 

Once you are satisfied, change to the next zone by using the Zone + and - keys.  Use the knob K2 and change this channel.

Continue until you have set all 4 zones to the channel(s) you want.

 

To finish, press the [Write] button.  You can use K2 to dial in the stage setting number you want to save this as.  Cursor Down and you can edit the stage setting name.  When satisfied, Press [Enter] and follow the prompts.

 

Change to your next Stage setting and repeat the process

 

Once your stage settings are setup and written with the midi channels you want, during a performance, just switch between your stage settings to use those channels.

 

 

NOTE:

I may have written something confusing when it comes to the song sequencer.  The song sequencer can build a song with 8 tracks.  I don't want to confuse this with Parts or tracks I was referring to with midi playback.   For the purposes of you controlling external devices by switching stage settings, you don't have to worry or think about the song sequencer.

[Hugh O Kelly]

Choppin,

 

I got it

 

I got it  (well ! the donkey explained it to me)

 

             

 

Fantastic 

You must be commended on your endurance and  tenacity.

You got there in the end.

Not many can get through my thick (tick) scull but you and the donkey did.

Thank you ,thank you thank you,

 

ALL THE BEST

Hugh

 

It was the midi edit/external out ch that clinched it in the end,thanks.

[Choppin]

No problem.  The Px-5s has a little different setup than what most are used to.  For me, once I wrapped my brain around the concept of a zone being the "vessel" so to speak for the rest of the building blocks and the zones all tie back to the stage settings, the Px-5s management became a bit more intuitive.