rsaintjohn Posted June 18, 2021 Share Posted June 18, 2021 I’ve spent the evening experimenting with the CT-S1, the WU-BT10 adapter, and some mobile devices. One thing has me stumped right now. As I moved to testing MIDI In from an external device (iPhone, running Zenbeats, sending notes out from its timeline to CT-S1), it seems the CT-S1 only plays the default Stage Piano tone. Even if I change the Tone on the CT, the notes are still the piano (but live play on keys is the selected Tone). I’ve checked through the User Manual and MIDI spec, but it doesn’t say much about MIDI In, just Out. Before I spend hours on this: does anyone know if this is behavior as designed? Would I somehow need to execute a Program Change to get the notes to play a different Tone? Is there a comparable limit or method on other current Casio keyboards? I know not many of us yet have the CT-S1, but any advice is appreciated. TIA! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted June 18, 2021 Share Posted June 18, 2021 I think it's the same as many other Casio models, where your MIDI IN has it's own sound generator, completely independent from what you are hearing when local control is on. So yes, a program change message would be needed. More than likely, all you need to do is start the recorder, then select the tone you want. The S1 should send the necessary program change, which would then get recorded. By the way, I think the entire GM sound set is hiding in the S1, accessible by MIDI, drums too. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfahrner02 Posted June 18, 2021 Share Posted June 18, 2021 (edited) I've been working with the CT-S1 MIDI input the last couple of days, trying to play it from an external controller, and came to the same conclusion as Brad: there's a separate independent GM engine in there that isn't controlled by anything on the CT-S1 panel, and you have to send a program change (and presumably anything else you need that's listed in the implementation chart)...until you send the program change, the default program for the MIDI input channels seems to be #1, acoustic piano, (although I haven't checked Channel 10, which ought to be drums)...I've used a couple of controllers (Alesis Q-series and Arturia Keystep) and once you send the program change everything else seems to work...of course the problem here is getting a USB MIDI input from external controllers: I made an adapter with a Hobbytronix MIDI Host board that converts standard 5-pin Din MIDI to USB class-compliant MIDI...then I had to use another adapter (MIDI Solutions Event Processor Plus) to generate the program change message, since the Keystep couldn't do that on its own...enough of this, I need to go play some music... df Edited June 19, 2021 by dfahrner02 Brad, I got your name wrong, sorry 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsaintjohn Posted June 18, 2021 Author Share Posted June 18, 2021 8 minutes ago, dfahrner02 said: ...enough of this, I need to go play some music... I was starting to tell myself the same thing last night, as I felt I was violating the spirit of the CT-S1. I always seem to fall into this inevitable mindset of trying to get gear to do what it wasn’t meant to do. Nevertheless, Imma gonna keep doin it. You both have given me valuable clues so I’m going to dig a little deeper. I also suspected those GM sounds are in there because that demo mode certainly has a lot of drums in it. I’m more interested in seeing what can be done with a live performance on top of a pre-programmed MIDI track. I may even see if I can create a Tone changer for that hidden engine using MIDI Designer Pro so that I can easily send the changes from an iPhone or iPad. Whatever results I get, I’ll post back here in this thread. Thanks again! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted June 18, 2021 Share Posted June 18, 2021 I'm going to be sticking with the spirit of the CT-S1 this time, I think. Yes, I will. I promise. 😇 (Please ignore the fact I was looking for apps to do things it wasn't meant to do) 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XW-Addict Posted June 21, 2021 Share Posted June 21, 2021 I'm way to excited its new its < addictive > 😎, played an hour straight after work until I had to stop myself. I've ordered the bag for it as well , dang I got my practice piano with sounds I love. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IO529 Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 Is there anyway to hook the piano up with midi through without the BT? Hooked into Logic Pro, I could only Access the Logic sounds and not the Ct S1 sounds, it is recording the Midi info but not the sounds. Any Advice? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 55 minutes ago, IO529 said: I could only Access the Logic sounds and not the Ct S1 sounds, it is recording the Midi info but not the sounds. The MIDI connection will only record MIDI data, whether it is Bluetooth or wired. You will need to set MIDI OUT from Logic to the CT-S1 in order to trigger sounds in the Casio, then connect an audio cable from the CT-S1 to your computer in order to record sound from the keyboard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay C Posted July 31, 2021 Share Posted July 31, 2021 On 7/21/2021 at 7:30 PM, Brad Saucier said: The MIDI connection will only record MIDI data, whether it is Bluetooth or wired. You will need to set MIDI OUT from Logic to the CT-S1 in order to trigger sounds in the Casio, then connect an audio cable from the CT-S1 to your computer in order to record sound from the keyboard. Hi Brad I am blending in in the conversation: my CT-S1 is connected via Bluetooth to my iPad. Audio out from the CT-S1 is routed out (via cable) into the audio in input on my PX-S5. Audio output from the PX-5S goes out from the two Line outs into my audio interface that is sending sound out through the connected speakers. the iPad is also connected to the audio interface via the lightning port. Now, I have managed to record midi from the CT-S1 to the DAW running on my iPad. When I add an audio track, in order to record the CT-S1 playing the midi notes with the piano sound, nothing is recorded to the audio track. what am I doing wrong? Also, when activate the cycle button in the transport panel in the DAW midi play back is delayed in the 1st. Repitition of the midi segment in question. Why? jay🎹 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted July 31, 2021 Share Posted July 31, 2021 How are you feeding audio from the CT-S1 to your recording software? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay C Posted July 31, 2021 Share Posted July 31, 2021 6 hours ago, Brad Saucier said: How are you feeding audio from the CT-S1 to your recording software? The problem was this. I had forgotten about a small, but paramount detail: in iOS, in settings, for the DAW app I am using, the microphone was disabled. The moment I enabled it again I could record audio from my CT-S1. Problem solved. 😂 Thanks for taking your time two answer my post. I appreciate it! 👍 Jay 🎹 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay C Posted August 1, 2021 Share Posted August 1, 2021 (edited) On 6/18/2021 at 7:46 AM, rsaintjohn said: Would I somehow need to execute a Program Change to get the notes to play a different Tone? Is there a comparable limit or method on other current Casio keyboards? Hi @rsaintjohn and others Look here: PX-5S: Sending Program Changes to External Gear | PRIVIA PRO BLOG (wordpress.com) I used the approach described on this blog, and now my PX-5S, via an altered stage setting, controls tone selection and triggers notes on the CT-S1. In addition to this, I can manipulation factors such as: filter cut-off filter resonance, attack time, chorus, delay reverb (and possible several other midi control change options that the CT-S1 supports) of the sound output from the from the CT-S1. plus effectively use pitch bender use modulation wheel on the PX-5S to affect the tone generation on the CT-S1. Jay 🎹 EDIT: Link to stage setting Edited August 1, 2021 by Jay C correcting typos and adding link. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthewisgrand Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 what driver do I need on my pc to receive midi from the wu-bt10 or is it only smart devices for now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 2 hours ago, matthewisgrand said: what driver do I need on my pc to receive midi from the wu-bt10 or is it only smart devices for now? Your computer needs to be Bluetooth LE capable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthewisgrand Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 Thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groove On Posted November 30, 2021 Share Posted November 30, 2021 (edited) FYI - CME added a MIDI Thru on their USB Bluetooth devices. The setting is called "USB Soft Thru" and it works on the Casio CT-S1. When ON, the local MIDI OUT from the CT-S1 keyboard will be routed THRU to the second MIDI sound module that only responds to External MIDI IN. So you can send Program Changes to the CT-S1 and immediately start playing the second MIDI sound module with the local keyboard. Big benefit, latency is very fast, no more long round-trips to the computer. It will be very useful for multi-keyboard set lists in Main Stage, Camelot Pro, On Song, KeyStage etc. - where we might send multiple Program Changes, Splits and Layers and immediately want to play the local CT-S1 keyboard. Perhaps this is something the Casio could also add to the WU-BT10. It's a very useful feature. Edited November 30, 2021 by Groove On 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsaintjohn Posted December 13, 2021 Author Share Posted December 13, 2021 On 8/1/2021 at 4:07 PM, Jay C said: Hi @rsaintjohn and others Look here: PX-5S: Sending Program Changes to External Gear | PRIVIA PRO BLOG (wordpress.com) I used the approach described on this blog, and now my PX-5S, via an altered stage setting, controls tone selection and triggers notes on the CT-S1. I just wanted to post a belated thanks to Jay and others for posting additional findings on the MIDI capabilities. Although I decided to go Zen with the CT-S1 and love it for what it is, I finally got around to unboxing my CT-S400 this weekend. These details helped me dig deeper into what could and couldn’t be done with MIDI and the 400. Now that I better understand the way the CTs want to receive Program Changes, I was able to use a few wireless iPhone apps to send messages and get under the skin a bit. More testing to do with a wired connection, I’ll report back if I find anything really amazing. More than anything, I just wanted to say thanks! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stidiek Posted January 4, 2022 Share Posted January 4, 2022 (edited) I've been able to play some hidden sounds: I've used a software to link an old Casio Ctk with the ct-s1 then changing advance tones in Ctk the sounds started to appear. Next Step will Be to identity those messages so we can used them from any source. Edited January 4, 2022 by Stidiek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d. gauss Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 has anyone found any easy way to simply change patches on the CT-S1 with an ipad?(connected via wire not bluetooth) i thought chordana could do it, but that seems to be incorrect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d. gauss Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 anybody? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d. gauss Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 fwiw, this free app works like a charm to change the program sounds internally(GM?) that are triggered externally. however, the problem still remains that the sound from actually playing the keys on the CT-s1 remains the piano sound. ay yi yi. Program Changer on the App Store (apple.com) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 Everyone is using the 61 keys to select among the 61 tones. I find it is pretty easy. It might be nicer to select from an iPad, unfortunately the local sound engine is not internally wired to receive MIDI in any way. The keyboard has a separate dedicated MIDI only sound engine. The idea behind that is to provide the user with a sound engine for MIDI use that will not interfere with local sounds, as when playing MIDI files and such. Theoretically, an app that can perform a MIDI loopback and also merge program changes should do it, and also turn off local control. I don't know if an app like that exists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kybdsammer Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 Check out this thread: You may want to try MidiStage. Casio Forum Member Reg MidiStage created MidiStage web-based app that I have used with the CT-S1 to select CT-S1 sounds and GM sounds with the ability to layer them too. I used MidiStage with my iPad and CT-S1 the other day for a small group worship time and was able to create layered presets for each song (some with four sounds at once including a mix of CT-S1 and GM sounds, some with keyboard splits, and one for keyboard drums). I just set up the presets and pressed the desired preset for each song. My iPad is wired directly to my CT-S1 (I use a USB to Lightning adapter too). Be sure to click on his link and read the welcome message and quick intro on how to set it up. I needed to load an app on my iPad to get it to work. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d. gauss Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 thanks. midiStage is pretty cool. mucho potential. let's see how it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kybdsammer Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 30 minutes ago, d. gauss said: thanks. midiStage is pretty cool. mucho potential. let's see how it goes. Many thanks to @Reg MidiStage for developing this, sharing it with us, and working with us to add new instruments. This is one of the reasons why I love this forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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