Must read - before you buy CT-X3000 or X5000

[casio_style]

3 hours ago, Synthwave said:

Indeed, that can be done with a Daw that accepts bank and program changes, but it cannot be done (in situ) with a hardware sequencer, an external keyboard or a software sequencer like the korg gadget, for these, you have to do the trick of recording the mrf and play it.
Do you realize that to do something as easy as setting up the keyboard mixer (as you can do on a Wk or XW) you need an external element such as a PC? Do you think this is practical or even logical? We are justifying the unjustifiable. It is a bad design, there is no excuse.

An external element is not needed, if you do not want to use a PC, then you can record everything and save it on the synthesizer. On a PC it is just more convenient, also on a PC, in a DAW, you can set up such controllers that are not available through the mixer of the synthesizer itself. For example: cutoff controller, resonance controller, vibrato controllers (depth, rate, delay)
This way you can get very finely tuned tones on the mixer midi synthesizer input.
I suggested a way, you can use or continue to say, "how bad everything is at the casio."
Just think of these midi templates as registration banks for a midi mixer. And you can have a large number of such templates. (midi files are configured on a PC, but then they need to be loaded onto a USB flash drive that connects to the synthesizer, that is, they are then stored on the synthesizer)
And yes, with a PC using a DAW, you won't be able to set up a midi-in mixer as quickly, much less all 16 channels. And here it is simple, for example dialed the number 555, pressed start and the mixer was set up.
Of course, it will take some time to prepare the midi files, but it pays off later.
Perhaps you did not quite understand exactly what I wanted to say. Here Google translator will translate how, I can't say.

And yes, this method of setting up the midi-in mixer can be used on other Casio models, for example, in the CTK series
But it is inconvenient to look for a midi there, there is no numeric keypad, and therefore this method is not so effective.

[Joe Muscara]

1 hour ago, Synthwave said:

When you wrote this in your head it sounded funny, right? Do you know how many people I have seen asking how to put samples in the ctx? In the manual it does not say that it can be. Have you seen the previous posts? In the manual it does not say that to configure the midi mixer you have to configure the mixer in song mode ..... it seems that you like to ridicule other people's words but do not read and understand.

It was funny when I said it out loud, too. 😅

 

I've never seen a keyboard that was not a sampler or that couldn't load samples bother to put that in the manual. If you listed everything a keyboard couldn't do, the manual would be enormous and people wouldn't be able to find what it can do.

 

If the manual left out how to do something like what you're saying, that's a legit complaint and good feedback. Casio should be able to update that. But this idea that we should have a warning thread about what this model cannot do is absurd. The PX-5S is not a workstation, should there be a thread about all the workstation features it is "missing"? Should people be warned the CT-X models don't have weighted keys? The CT-X series do what they do, and many of the features and designs are the way Casio has been doing it for years, like it or not. Assuming they would do something because a competitive model does it or does it that way is strange to me. You might want that, you might suggest it to Casio, but don't buy the 'board and be disappointed it doesn't do it that way, and don't be disappointed that it is not made to do so in a "firmware update" (which is something people seem to expect miracles from nowadays).

 

Excuse me, I hear a wave calling…  

[Chandler Holloway]

2 hours ago, Synthwave said:

Do you know how many people I have seen asking how to put samples in the ctx? In the manual it does not say that it can be.

It’s the first sentence of the “Editing User Tones” section:

 

You can edit a BUILT-IN tone to create a user tone. Seems pretty clear to me that you’re not going to be able to put completely new sounds on this keyboard, but rather edit presets. What about this sentence is confusing or vague to you?

 

Is it too hard for someone to find? Because if you want to edit a tone, and you go to the manual page that covers the tone editing process, and you skip over the very first sentence in that section... yikes.
 

Did you find the marketing misleading? Casio will mention sampling as a feature up front, prominently, if one of their keyboards supports it. Compare the product pages for the CT-X5000 to those of the MZ-X500 and the WK-245. Why would Casio put sampling at the forefront of the advertising for some models, but then completely neglect to mention it for another? Probably because it doesn’t have that feature.
 

Why take up space in advertising or reference material to talk about features that your instrument doesn’t have? They were pretty clear about what Editing A User Tone means, I think. Is there much of a need to have a disclaimer saying “This keyboard can’t sample” in the manual, when sampling capabilities were never once mentioned in any promotional material, specs sheets, product demos etc?

 

Yes, there are people on the forums who ask if the CT-X can sample. They either didn’t read the manual/specs sheet, or they’re new to electronic musical instruments. We’re happy to explain that it can’t sample and suggest alternatives (I have done this in many of the topics that you are referencing), because user support groups are ideal for answering questions like that and giving advice to less experienced users. But on the other hand, why should the manual cater to people who don’t read the manual?

 

[casio_style]

2 hours ago, Synthwave said:

 In the manual it does not say that to configure the midi mixer you have to configure the mixer in song mode ..... it seems that you like to ridicule other people's words but do not read and understand.

You just have to carefully read and watch the manuals, open page 144 and you will see a diagram of the midi ports on the casio and there you can see that the song mixer and the midi in mixer are the same mixer. I read the entire synthesizer manual before buying the synthesizer itself and I know what it can and what not, so I have no questions.
And I knew, for example, that there was no WAV recorder and there were no complaints on this issue either. I also knew that there was no step editing in the pattern sequencer, and so on.
 What I didn't know is that USB MIDI works so badly, it really needs to be fixed by Casio engineers as soon as possible. Because those who are constantly working with DAW will give up this synthesizer.

[Chandler Holloway]

You're deflecting, and this question is off-topic.

46 minutes ago, Synthwave said:

What I try is to make it clear to a person who is new to this that they are clear about what they buy, and yes, the vast majority of people who buy a ctx are beginners, because for those people the keyboard is directed, even if they do not want to see is like this .... the ctx is neither advanced nor professional, the mzx for example if it is. Now I wait for the post "The mzx has a higher price and etc, etc, etc, etc" well now I ask you becuse you work for Casio: the money I pay for a ctx 3000 is justified considering the problems it gives me with the port usb and the DAW? Don't you think that Casio should do something to fix it?

 

What does any of that have to do with your claim that the manual is unclear about whether or not you can sample on the CT-X? I've been very careful about only disputing CT-X complaints in this topic that I feel are plainly untrue, and that's all I've done. I'm not trying to stop anyone from bringing up legitimate issues with these instruments, but I will step in if I feel a claim is incorrect. The aim of this thread is to present prospective buyers with a factual list of shortcomings on these models, and even if I don't agree with the negative tone of some of these posts, it's still a legitimate topic for discussion. But if I don't think you're right when you criticize this keyboard, it's fair for me to point out why I disagree and provide my reasoning.

 

Straight up: Do you think the manual or the marketing for the CT-X misleads people about sampling capabilities, and if so, what exactly was said about the tone editing capabilities that made people believe sampling was possible? If you're going to make a claim like that, it would help to point out exactly where and when so that the problem can be avoided in the future.

[casio_style]

59 minutes ago, Synthwave said:

 In the xw you change and save, without tricks without having to remember to play the file first. simple and easy.

And what does XW have to do with it? Are we talking about him? And why should everything work on CTX like on XW? For example, I have never used XW and it does not matter to me how everything works there. When I start using XW I will figure it out and of course I will not compare how everything worked differently on CTX or on Genos ...

[casio_style]

19 minutes ago, Synthwave said:

Please tell me in which paragraph of the manual you mention that a midi file must be generated in order to change the tones of the midi mixer. Ahhhh no, you won't find it. And you're going to tell me that by looking at the midi implementation chart, everyone knows that you have to do it that way ... you're not right.

You claim that you are using a DAW and must understand that any midi that you run on the synthesizer will change the settings of the midi mixer. And the mixer settings can change not only the midi file, but the song file.
I chose the midi file to save the settings, because it's convenient. It is convenient to search for them, they do not need to be loaded into the synthesizer memory like a song file. They run directly from a USB stick.
Now I always connect the midi keyboard to the synthesizer, started the midi file and the desired timbre was installed on the mixer midi in and I can safely play on the 88 key midi keyboard. I understand that you like the problem itself, not its solution, so I will not write anything else on this topic.

[casio_style]

22 minutes ago, Synthwave said:

look, it's not about xw, I gave it as an example because it's from Casio and you could know it. In 25 years that I have been buying keyboards and synthesizers (the ctx is not a synthesizer, although you insist on that) I have never had to record a midi file to configure the mixer, it seems to me to be ridiculous. The ctx is one of a kind ... feel special.

Again, you may not need to record the midi or run it to tune the mixer to the midi in. The mixer midi in can be configured via the mixer song solo.
I myself chose the midi file for setting up the mixer, because that's more convenient for me. I can control more parameters through it, I can even set up a 1-9 keyboard mixer through it (using sysex) to play 4 layer timbres. Therefore, there is no problem for me in this matter. 

 

[Joe Muscara]

[RogerBannister]

5 hours ago, Joe Muscara said:

Agreed.

 

Sounds like everyone wants the moon on a stick for $300

 

The CT-X series aren't perfect (what is?) but they offer a lot for the price, in general.

[casio_style]

8 hours ago, Synthwave said:

A blind person does not see, that is not a problem for a person who is not blind because he does see. So the blind person does not have a problem ...... I repeat that you like it, it does not mean that this is the normal way to configure a mixer. And we could go on like this all day, but no, because when you're blind, you don't see.

I use the midi file to set up the mixer, not because I'm blind or because the Casio CTX has mixer limitations. I have been using it enough, for a long time, even on CTK7000.
Because the question was how to save the mixer B settings and always use these settings when the need arises.
Therefore, a midi file is like a registration bank file, only for a mixer, a midi input. I already wrote about this above, but apart from your fictitious problem you do not notice anything, so you are more likely to be blind.
Now the questions:
 1) Can you adjust the cutoff parameters through the casio mixer? The answer is no. And I can do it through the midi file.
2) Can you adjust the resonance controller parameter through the casio mixer? The answer is no. And I can do it through the midi file.
3) Can you adjust the vibration or aftertouch control parameters through the casio mixer? The answer is no. And I can do it through the midi file
4) Will you be able to send sysexes through the casio mixer in order to configure the mixer 1 - 9 keyboard at once? The answer is no. And I can do it through the midi file. And all this in 3 seconds ...
There are other possibilities that I see it makes no sense for you to talk about and waste your time on it.
So goodbye and don't have to answer that. There will be no answer from me.
It's just that this information may be useful to other users, that's why I'm writing.

[casio_style]

2 hours ago, jose antonio tafalla blas said:

Mr casio-style, I am sorry to tell you that you have not discovered the fire ... the midi and sysex method has been used for more than 30 years when precisely the keyboards did not have register banks, buttons, sequencer menus or operating system ..... you may feel lucky as your ctx takes you back in time, for free. I get the impression that you have not used many keyboards in your life .....

 

Edit:And all that could be done in local mode, unlike ctx, which to be practical you must sequence it externally or loopback (which was also done in the 80s) because those wonderful changes that you make in your powerhouse " synth "only affect the Midi engine. Super-practical.

Perhaps I did not understand what you wanted to say, but I do not need a loop - a cable for setting up the mixer, I run the midi file for setting on the synthesizer itself.
You can control not only the midi mixer, but also the main mixer, but everything must be done there through the sysexes. Loop - a cable is also not needed for this, everything is also done by starting the midi file. Moreover, through the sysexes there is access to such functions on the synthesizer, which are unlikely to ever be available in the normal mode of using the synthesizer. For example, change the parameters of DSP effects in real time and so on.
Of course, I did not discover anything new for the world, but I still discovered a lot of new and useful things for myself, and this is more important for me. It is important to develop.
And the synthesizer is what it is. No company usually upgrades already released synthesizers and therefore there is only one way out, if you do not like the synthesizer and there are no functions that you really need, then you will have to look for another synthesizer. We all, sooner or later, change synthesizers.
It will be good if the MIDI USB is fixed, they must do that. This function is declared in the synthesizer, we can say that we paid for it and let it work fine, although when connecting via MIDIUSB with midi keyboards or other synthesizers, I had no problems. As I understand this problem exists only in DAW.

[ConfusedRedditor16]

Anyone else have trouble with the dial becoming wobbly? Like I said, I was pretty shocked when I played that old ctk 7200, that dial is smaller but feels much more solid

[Jokeyman123]

Might be a good idea to shut this thread down-its going in circles and taking up valuable server space for useless bickering. 

[casio_style]

3 hours ago, jose antonio tafalla blas said:

Honestly, I would like to know how you do to read a midi file on the usb and that it affects the local mode. This in theory is impossible since midi and the local generator are materially separated. I say it with sincere curiosity.

 

I don't read the midi file, I just play it on the synthesizer and it adjusts the synthesizer mixers as I need it. Syxes are not channel messages, there is no concept of "midi mixer" or "main mixer" for them. They go straight to the brain of the synthesizer, so to speak. In full format, I can't explain it, if it's interesting, it's all here https://support.casio.com/storage/en/manual/pdf/EN/008/CT-X5000-midi-imple_EN.pdf
True, this instruction is truncated and does not contain all the data, but I have a full version of the midi instruction for the CTK 7000 and comparing and analyzing, I find what I need. Not yet figured out everything on the CT-X5000.
And for CTK7000 I have all the information on controlling the synthesizer through the sysex.

[casio_style]

1 hour ago, jose antonio tafalla blas said:

The fantastic sound of the aix chip has him confused ......
I'm going to answer because I like to discuss technical issues .....

1.Yes, I wanted to say "play a midi file from usb"
2. For you "real time" is playing a midi, that for the rest of humanity is called playback.
3. The DSP parameters to which you refer so much (and also the pìchbend, the modulation etc.) are those of the global mode. They are not of individual sounds.
4.Resonance, cutoff, release etc ... are channel midi messages, they are not sysex and are part of the midi mixer and do not affect as much as you say, local mode. And of course they cannot be changed in real time (true "real time") if an external controller is not connected before.
5. All those sysex changes you refer to are automatically generated by ctx when you convert mrf to midi on the keyboard itself.
6. The only way to change the global parameters in live, is to save a "registration" for each configuration that you want to change and press buttons as you need.
7. I know the manual well, thank you.

 

8. On the other hand, if you are saying that the midi implementation of the manual is incomplete, you are giving the reason to the people who say that the manual is incomplete and not well expressed. Which here many deny.

 

I'm going to see the ctk manual .....

I didn't understand what you want at all.
I am using a midi file to set up a mixer.
I have not written anywhere that the cutoff, resonance and other controllers are sysexes. I clearly know what sysex is and what controllers are.
For example, on CTK7000 there are 8 controllers (16,17, 18, 19, 20, 80, 81, 82, 83) that can change DSP parameters in real time and they are not related to the midi mixer. And if you assign them, for example, to the midi keyboard twists, nothing prevents you from changing the DSP parameters in real time.
And all this is not for this topic, if all this is interesting, then we will create another topic and there you can discuss everything.