PX-5S velocity issue?

[Christoph Clause]

I have a PX-5S and really love it. I have discovered something about the keyboard velocities though that I am wondering if anyone else out there has experienced. It seems impossible to get the highest velocities out of the keyboard. Like in the range of about 115-127. Changing the velocity settings (light / normal / heavy) doesn't help. The only way I can actually send a velocity of 127 (to both the internal sounds AND the Midi outputs) is to set the velocity setting to 'OFF' and make the off velocity level 127. I am a professional pianist and the most I can get out of it is MAYBE about 122-124 and that's literally only if I slam my hands ridiculously hard onto it. Any normal type of heavy playing does not get above about 110 or so. Seems like something is wrong, or perhaps there is some other adjustment or setting I am missing? Thank you to anyone who might have some insight into this.

[Brad Saucier]

How are you measuring velocity internally?  I'm curious to see this.  I don't think it is possible for the velocity sensing system to malfunction.  

[Christoph Clause]

Internally, I know that the velocities are not reaching their maximum because of the sound of the patches. For example, if I have the basic 0-0 ConcertGrand patch loaded, and I send midi information from my DAW at velocity 127, I know how the piano sounds at that velocity level. It is not possible to create the same brighter sound from playing the PX keyboard. UNLESS I go into the system settings / general / touch and set that to 'off', then set the 'touch off velocity' to 127. Then every key I play will be at 127 and the patch sounds with the maximum velocity. When setting the touch back to light, normal or heavy, it is impossible to create the maximum 127 velocity sound on the patches.

That's how I know that the velocities are not reaching their maximum values for the internal sounds as well as t the MIDI output. I wonder if it's possible that something is wrong with my particular PX? I bought it about 4 years ago, and I think it's always been this way. I just didn't really notice until recently when I was trying to play the sounds from my Yamaha Reface CP. It's impossible to get the 'bite' out of the Rhodes and Wurli sounds on it, which are quite nice. They sound very mellow when controlled from the PX because of the velocity issue.

[Brad Saucier]

I would double check by configuring a zone to sound only when velocity goes beyond a certain level.  I would use 125 as the low end velocity.  

[Christoph Clause]

Thanks for that suggestion. I tried it and set the level at 126. It appears that I CAN in fact hit a 127 velocity, so I am incorrect. In order to get that velocity though, I have to hit the keys extremely hard. Harder than I would ever play. I really have to smash down on the keys as hard as I can to get that level, and this is when set to the 'light' touch setting. I don't even want to do that test too much as it seems like I could break the keyboard hitting that hard! I wonder if there are any other velocity curve adjustments besides the 3 'light, normal, heavy' settings? It doesn't seem like there is from what I can tell.

I've ordered one of these, which should help with controlling external MIDI gear and Virtual Instrument plugins etc.

 

http://www.midisolutions.com/prodvel.htm

 

 

[Brad Saucier]

I would try some of the alternative piano tones. Some of them will be easier to reach the brighter dynamics than others.  Different tones can have different amplitude and filter response characteristics.  Have you also checked out our PX-5S downloads section for even more variety?  

[Jokeyman123]

I think you are hitting one of the "brick walls" that is a bit of a dirty little secret with digitals-I recall doing Midiox tests with many keyboards a few years ago, weighted and unweighted-and most I've tried at least cannot reach 127 velocity-and are usually quite a bit lower in the maximum range. I just did some new google searches on this-it is surprising how little information is available regarding the true midi velocity ranges of digital pianos and workstations-I am only going by my tests which might be limiting in scope. I'm not sure why this is so-could be that the midi data stream is more capable than what the physical limitations of these digital instruments can provide. You can play or record up to 127 velocity easily enough in software-but the weighted keys may not be capable of getting that large a "span" of velocity. I will run some tests on my Casios and a few others-to refresh my info, but as i said, I recall being surprised at the velocity limits of the weighted-action keyboards in general, and i can find no current charts or comparisons anywhere online regarding this. I also have run into this lack of velocity range with digital drumkits-it is equally difficult-and I can hit pretty hard-to reach 127 velocity with pad controllers. I think this is why many software DAW's allow for editing velocity response once you record. even my old SY-77 had settings for increasing or decreasing my recorded track's velocities-per track/per measure, even per note! Not my favorite hobby! 

[Christoph Clause]

5 hours ago, Brad Saucier said:

I would try some of the alternative piano tones. Some of them will be easier to reach the brighter dynamics than others.  Different tones can have different amplitude and filter response characteristics.  Have you also checked out our PX-5S downloads section for even more variety?  

I haven't yet, but need to do that! I think my problem is not so much the internal sounds, but more the controlling of other external sounds. The new midi solutions box I am getting will solve my problems with that though. I just wish the PX had more control over the velocity settings.

[Choppin]

I noticed that years ago with the PX.   I do think it's partly the keybed and action design.  The keys themselves don't have snap and are very slow when returning to a resting position so it's not easy to do super clean trills or repeated keys.  I think this ties into the velocity too.  The mechanism just isn't great.  I love my PX-5s but the key playability is only OK.  For slow passages and expressive playing It does great and feels great; but fast playing, repeated notes and loud playing - just so so.

 

I used MIDIOX to intercept velocities at 110 and above and automatically shoot them up to 127 on the output.  This was the only way i could get the punch I needed for external instruments when I'd play aggressively.

Edited July 19, 2021 by Choppin