Ctx5000 with up to 9 layered tones

[nilson]

The ctx5000 shows 9 channels in the keyboard mixer setup, is there any way I can combine up to 9 tones simultaneously (multi-layered) on this keyboard?

[dftx3]

User's guide

Sounding Multiple Tones (Layer and Split) . . . . . . EN-19

 

 

Edited August 3, 2022 by dftx3

[dftx3]

According to Casio manual,

Ch1  assigned to Upper 1

Ch2 assigned to Upper 2

You can layer two tones to play at the same time. 

 

Split and layer can be used at the same time, which means that you perform with up to four keyboard 
parts (UPPER 1, LOWER 1, UPPER 2, LOWER 2) at the same time (not four layer).

 

 

Edited August 3, 2022 by dftx3

[dftx3]

It is possible to output not only 9 tones, but up to 16 simultaneously with tones from ct-x (16 MIDI IN channels).  

But not with ct-x alone.  

I use a midi keyboard controller for this, which has 4 zones that allow split and/or layer, so I can play 4 layers simultaneously.  As far as I know, they are midi keyboards controllers even with 8 zones, that means 8 layers.  

You can also get this through PC daw.

Edited August 1, 2022 by dftx3

[Akshansh - Alex]

You can play two tones at the same time on the upper side and two tones on the lower section.

 

If you select "Auto Harmonize's Octave" option then you will be able to play three tone at the same times. You can not select the third tone but you can adjust the mixer settings of that part (Part 5). 

[dftx3]

On 8/1/2022 at 1:41 PM, Akshansh Khare - Alex said:

You can play two tones at the same time on the upper side and two tones on the lower section.

 

If you select "Auto Harmonize's Octave" option then you will be able to play three tone at the same times. You can not select the third tone but you can adjust the mixer settings of that part (Part 5). 

 

@Akshansh Khare - Alex Wrong!  You're confusing and that's not helping at all.  

According to the Casio manual, you can layer two tones at the same time, not three.  Auto Harmonize/Arpegiator layer is something else in concept, add another notes at what you play, and sounds with Upper 1 tone.

 

 

 

 

Edited August 3, 2022 by dftx3

[Brad Saucier]

Alex is correct.  Auto harmonize can perform as another layer when set to octave.  It's like gaining an upper 3 tone.  I've done this myself in the past.  On some other models, you can even change the tone using the mixer.  As Alex mentioned, unfortunately that's not possible on a CTX.  

[dftx3]

Ok, on ct-x3000 with upper layer on + auto harmonize on, I can have 2 tones on 3 layers. I can't have 3 different tones on 3 layers.

 

The concept of multiple layers means that when you play, for example, C4, you can hear C4 played by 2 or more different tones at the same time, in unison, depending on how many layers the keyboard has.  

If I turn on Auto Harmonize, I'll hear C4 G3, or C4 E3 G3, or C4 C3, etc., depending by Harmonize settings.

Edited August 1, 2022 by dftx3

[dftx3]

20 hours ago, nilson said:

The ctx5000 shows 9 channels in the keyboard mixer setup, is there any way I can combine up to 9 tones simultaneously (multi-layered) on this keyboard?

 

In short, to answer your question precisely, no, you cannot combine up to 9 tones with this keyboard alone.  It is possible with another midi keyboard controller or with PC daw software.

Edited August 1, 2022 by dftx3

[Jokeyman123]

Nilson's original question-layering 9 tones-I believe Nilson you are trying to create a massive 9-layer tone to play live, not as distinct multi-track assignments?

 

The only way I can think of doing this-would be-assigning each mixer channel and individual tone in each channel to the same midi channel-and trigger all 9 tracks with either the CTX keyboard (which i don't believe it can do) or with an external mid controller set to output on one channel-whichever channel you've re-configured the mixer midi channels to. But every Casio I own has midi channel assignments hard-wired, as everybody else has already posted, to specific layering or split midi channel assignments. Even with a controller capable of transmitting on 8+ different midi channels simultaneously, using separate channels for each transmitted midi path-without being able to edit the CTX mixer receive channels to the same channel or to the external controller's midi out channel assignments  I can't think of a way to do this, except with some kind of midi "re-channelizer"-that would have the capability to somehow-through I would guess a software function/midi loop function-re-assign the midi channels in the CTX to the same channels.

 

What you are asking to do can be accomplished with other workstations-my fusion and Equinox can do this but I don't know of any Casios that can layer more than its hard-wired split and lyaer channels-even the px560 keeps its midi channels "hard-wired" depending upon what you want to use it for. I can layer however-2 hex layers for a total of 12 discrete tones played live, but for external access, these will still be hard-wired to the PX560 midi channel assignments for splits/layers. I could hypothetically use the PX560 as a tone module-and it will receive on up to 16 discrete midi channels-but again the midi channel assignements are hard-wired. And the hex layer will respond as one midi channel tone. Sorry getting off the subject. 

[Jokeyman123]

Oops, dftx3 beat me to it! The quick answer is no. Sorry got carried away here.

[dftx3]

It is possible to output not only 9 tones, but up to 16 simultaneously with tones from ct-x (16 MIDI IN channels).  

 

But not with ct-x alone.  

 

I use a midi keyboard controller for this, which has 4 zones that allow split and/or layer, so I can play 4 layers simultaneously.  As far as I know, they are midi keyboards controllers even with 8 zones, that means 8 layers.  

You can also get this through PC daw.

[Akshansh - Alex]

I don't know very well about live notes output of a 16 parts or if there is any option available to output all the 16 parts 'live'. But, you can record your notes that what you play and export it as SMF file format (.Mid) to play all the parts or channels simultaneously on any daw. 

[nilson]

thanks everyone for the replies.  I would like to be able to combine more than 2 layered tones (piano + EP + pad + strings + organ, for example), to play live with just the ctx5000.  when i saw the keyboard mixer 9 channels i thought there would be some way to do this even if it was edited through 3rd party software

Edited August 4, 2022 by nilson

[N. K. Shrivastava]

@nilson Please, let us know how did you played two or more tones at the same time live.

 

 

Thank you

[dftx3]

@nilson

Ct-x3000/5000 has the ability to play 2 different sounds (tones) at the same time from the same key(s), the so-called layer function. 

Ct-x3000/5000 has the ability to divide into 2 zones, upper and lower, the so-called split function. 

Ct-x3000/5000 has the ability to split and layer up to 2 upper and 2 lower.  

Ct-x3000/5000 has the ability to Auto-Harmonize what you play in upper 1, with 12 types of auto-harmonization.  Auto Harmonize function takes effect when playing chord in accompaniment zone (ACCOMP ON).  

However, by construction the Ct-x3000/5000 has 64 notes polyphony (32 for certain tones), so for this reason more than 2 upper layers would affect the quality of the performance (especially when using sustain, or chords) by reaching the threshold of notes played simultaneously.  

 

Ct-x3000/5000 user's guide:

"Some notes are cut off while they are playing.

Notes are cut off whenever the number of notes being sounded 
exceeds the maximum polyphony value of 64 (32 for some tones). 
This does not indicate malfunction."

 

I play with 3 layer through pc daw, stage piano + slwstrings + el organ, sounds good, but sometimes I get notes cut off, mostly strings release.

[nilson]

7 hours ago, N. K. Shrivastava said:

@nilson Please, let us know how did you played two or more tones at the same time live.

 

 

Thank you

sorry for the confusion.  but I didn't combine more than 2 tones, I just said I wanted to know if there is a way to do it

[nilson]

2 hours ago, dftx3 said:

@nilson

Ct-x3000/5000 has the ability to play 2 different sounds (tones) at the same time from the same key(s), the so-called layer function. 

Ct-x3000/5000 has the ability to divide into 2 zones, upper and lower, the so-called split function. 

Ct-x3000/5000 has the ability to split and layer up to 2 upper and 2 lower.  

Ct-x3000/5000 has the ability to Auto-Harmonize what you play in upper 1, with 12 types of auto-harmonization.  Auto Harmonize function takes effect when playing chord in accompaniment zone (ACCOMP ON).  

However, by construction the Ct-x3000/5000 has 64 notes polyphony (32 for certain tones), so for this reason more than 2 upper layers would affect the quality of the performance (especially when using sustain, or chords) by reaching the threshold of notes played simultaneously.  

 

Ct-x3000/5000 user's guide:

"Some notes are cut off while they are playing.

Notes are cut off whenever the number of notes being sounded 
exceeds the maximum polyphony value of 64 (32 for some tones). 
This does not indicate malfunction."

 

I play with 3 layer through pc daw, stage piano + slwstrings + el organ, sounds good, but sometimes I get notes cut off, mostly strings release.

dftx3,

 

thanks for the explanation.  I already knew about the layer and split mode, and the limitations of ctx.  I just wanted to know if there was a way to workaround these limitations.

 

I already had a Yamaha mx61 and it could combine up to 16 voices, but not through the keyboard itself, it needed performance editing software.  by the keyboard itself it was only possible to combine 2 voices. I thought the ctx might be similar.

 

how do you play 3 layered tones through the daw?  do you use only ctx and the computer for this?

[dftx3]

1 hour ago, nilson said:

how do you play 3 layered tones through the daw?  do you use only ctx and the computer for this?

 

A daw is a software application that runs on pc (mac, windows, linux).

 

If you don't want involve pc, you can use a midi keyboard controller with minim 4 zones feature + midi usb host device for connection between ctx and controller.

 

Yes, I use ct-x3000 and pc.  I use linux pc and Ardour daw, with all settings for music production, for realtime low latency Jack Audio server.  If you want more information, you can ask.

 

Edited August 5, 2022 by dftx3

[nilson]

On 8/5/2022 at 8:25 AM, dftx3 said:

 

A daw is a software application that runs on pc (mac, windows, linux).

 

If you don't want involve pc, you can use a midi keyboard controller with minim 4 zones feature + midi usb host device for connection between ctx and controller.

 

Yes, I use ct-x3000 and pc.  I use linux pc and Ardour daw, with all settings for music production, for realtime low latency Jack Audio server.  If you want more information, you can ask.

 

great!  Many thanks for the reply