thobert Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 Hi all - this may be an issue with me being a nube, but I can't get the line out to work. Here is the situation: - keyboard 1/4" TR line out connected to 1/4" TRS line in to a Steinberg audio interface by means of a standard TR "guitar" cable - have also tried TRS cables to no avail - have also tried TR and TRS cables to powered studio monitors line input to no avail. Is this an issue with TR to TRS or is my keyboard actually not producing audio line out? Have had the keyboard two days and have not touched the factory presents. The keyboard plays fine through the built-in speakers and through the headphone jacks up front, but want the line outs to go to audio interface. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 Welcome to the forums! Hmmm.... Are you saying the headphone jack connected to the interface works? I can't think of why the line out to the interface isn't working. I would first make sure the interface input is working, using something else that's already known to work, and that the cable is working fine on other gear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thobert Posted April 18, 2019 Author Share Posted April 18, 2019 Thanks Brad. Pleasure to be here. The TS cables and the audio interface (Steinberg UR242) line inputs are proven to work. I just tested with my Yamaha MX49. To conclude: Yamaha MX49 line out -> TR cables -> UR242 line in -> powered studio monitors = sound PX S3000 -> same TR cables -> same UR242 line in -> same powered studio monitors = no sound The headphone jack in the front of the unit does what I expect: plugging in headphones disables the onboard speakers and produces a headphone amped output that is controllable by the keyboard volume control. I'm expecting the line-outs to disable the onboard speakers and produce a line-level output NOT controllable by the keyboard volume control. Disabling the onboard speakers aside, I can not detect any audio output from the line-outs at any level of keyboard volume control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thobert Posted April 18, 2019 Author Share Posted April 18, 2019 I did an a little addition research and found that the line out audio specifications for the keyboard indicates a standard "pro-audio" 1.3 V RMS output. I can safely say that this keyboard is not producing a line out audio signal of that strength. Line levels and their approximate nominal voltage levels Use Nominal level Nominal level, VRMS Peak amplitude, VPK Peak-to-peak amplitude, VPP Professional audio +4 dBu 1.228 1.736 3.472 Consumer audio −10 dBV 0.316 0.447 0.894 I also found that, although there was a function to enable/disable the onboard speakers when headphones are plugged into the microphone jacks up front, there is no such function to enable/disable the onboard speakers when using a line output to an external amp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkycornwall Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 This is very interesting and seems to relate to issues with other Casio keyboards with speaker systems. Have you tried plugging a headphone jack into the headphone socket and then see if the audio out signal is increased? Maybe the process of turning off the on-board speakers will cause the line out output to be increased. Also is there not a setting to turn off the speakers without plugging a headphone socket in? Something in a settings menu? It seems odd to have to plug in a headphone to switch out the speakers. Sadly I don’t have access to this instrument to check any of these things out but sorting out these issues are vital for anyone wishing to gig with the instrument or record with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 I do know that at least one of my Casios does change the output signal based upon whether or not the headphone jack is being deployed. I don't know what the respective output signals are, never tested. And regarding the speaker on/off. This seems to be standard Casio practice, as years ago I modded a CTK wit my own physical switch to turn off the speakers when I wanted to use the outputs through amplification only. I wouldn't do this if you will void your warranty, and my CTK was not a new S3000! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkycornwall Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 I think you can turn the internal speakers off directly from the controls on the PX-560. They should have allowed for this feature in the PX-S3000 especially as it is considered to be a gigging keyboard as well as home. I hope thobert will try what I have suggested and report back the findings as I am sure many people are interested to find out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 One the PX-S3000, a plug has to be inserted in the headphone jack to turn off the internal speakers. The 'speaker out' setting menu in the PX-S3000 is for enabling the speakers at the same time the headphones jack is in use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thobert Posted April 19, 2019 Author Share Posted April 19, 2019 6 hours ago, funkycornwall said: I think you can turn the internal speakers off directly from the controls on the PX-560. They should have allowed for this feature in the PX-S3000 especially as it is considered to be a gigging keyboard as well as home. I hope thobert will try what I have suggested and report back the findings as I am sure many people are interested to find out. Indeed as Brad states, the PX-S3000 appears to lack the ability to disable the onboard speakers without plugging in headphones. This presents problem in the follow scenarios: - gigging where you want the sound to only come from the live sound system - home recording where you want to record the audio from the keyboard to you DAW and monitor your DAW through your studio monitors...imaging the issues with accompanying a vocalist in a home studio in that scenario. The work arounds for the above seems to be: - to use the Headphone mini plug in front (and not the 1/4" pro audio line out) as the source of the audio signal - Use the line out for the audio signal AND plug in headphones if only to kill the onboard speakers But we are getting ahead of ourselves...I still can't confirm that the line out is even working on my 3 day old keyboard. LOL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kybdsammer Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 Are there any other PX-S3000 owners who have successfully used the line out jacks? Based on the many YouTube videos that I've seen, it appears the line out jacks are being used and producing a great, quality output signal. Maybe the line out jacks in your unit are not working properly. It may be worth getting it checked. Regarding the speaker on/off setting, if it only works when the headphone jack is used, this would be limiting. It would be nice to have a global speaker on/off setting for more flexibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkycornwall Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 As a test can you try plugging a mini jack (no need for Headphones) into the headphone socket and see if the output from rear L and R audio out is increased for recording. I seem to remember from when I had a PX-350 I used to carry a spare jack and plugged it into the headphone socket. Then as a result the audio outs were increased to a satisfactory state when plugged into the PA. maybe it is the same with the S3000 but I have not got access to one to test out. If this is the case then I think Casio has not designed the system properly. You should not have to use workarounds like this. But maybe (I hope) I am wrong. We need someone who is using a PX-S3000 for possible gigging to reply to this thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thobert Posted April 22, 2019 Author Share Posted April 22, 2019 I did some additional testing and here is what I found. My main use case for the keyboard is for home recording where I want to record the audio from the keyboard through my audio interface, to my DAW as an audio track, and monitor the DAW back out through my audio interface with my studio monitors or headphones connected to the audio interface. (Incidentally, I don't need any help with the keyboard as a MIDI controller...that works fine...so I'm really just talking about that specific audio output use case.) The line out does in fact work: 1) plug in a random mini plug into the headphone jacks in the front of the unit to kill the onboard speakers 2) turn the keyboard volume to max...yes max...see point 3 3) I eke out an audio signal in my DAW. Below is the meter with the volume maxed and with me hammering on the keys at max velocity. Workable, yes, but given the pro-audio +4 dBu specifications of the Line Out, just doesn't seem right. I don't have the equipment to verify the 1.3 Volt MAX RMS output of the line outs, so I'll leave it at that. If I ever need a stronger signal, I might just end up using the Microphone out and not the Line out. To answer funkycornwall's specific question, I see no increase or decrease on the Line Out strength from plugging in (or unplugging) my random mini plug to disable the onboard speakers. Thanks all for your suggestions! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
havingfun Posted April 23, 2019 Share Posted April 23, 2019 Thobert: I just got my PX-S3000. I don't like the tinny sound of the tiny on-board speakers so I connected my line-outs to a 100W stereo amp (I used the "video" RCA inputs on the amp). My bookshelf speakers get driven well with this set up (and sound much better than the keyboard speakers). I have the keyboard set at about 3/4 volume and the amp at about 1/2 max volume. If there are any other tests you would like me to try with my set up, let me know. Unfortunately, I don't know of a way to measure the line-out peak to peak voltages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkycornwall Posted April 23, 2019 Share Posted April 23, 2019 It would be good if an expert like Mike Martin could clear up and clarify this subject once and for all. I did look through the manual but nothing seemed to specifically refer to the line out output for gigging and recording. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Martin Posted April 23, 2019 Share Posted April 23, 2019 23 hours ago, thobert said: IWorkable, yes, but given the pro-audio +4 dBu specifications of the Line Out, just doesn't seem right. I believe the line outputs are -10dBV, not +4 dBu. I've recorded with the PX-S3000 and obviously we've used it live as well at NAMM. I'll do a side by side tomorrow at the office with the PX-5S to compare and let you know what I find out. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkycornwall Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 I have been told that there is (or will be) a new software feature on the PX-S3000 which will enable you to turn the speakers off on the instrument without having to resort to a headphone jack. That's good news I think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Martin Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 1 hour ago, funkycornwall said: I have been told that there is (or will be) a new software feature on the PX-S3000 which will enable you to turn the speakers off on the instrument without having to resort to a headphone jack. That's good news I think No that isn't the case. The software control actually is the opposite. It allows you to re-enable the speakers even if headphones are being used. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Martin Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Unscientific side by side comparison with the PX-5S the line output level is identical. Generally speaking Casio instruments leave a little extra headroom compared to some instruments, there are a variety of reasons for that. The PX-S3000 can produce playback from roughly 40 MIDI channels at once!! 16 for MIDI File Playback 16 for USB MIDI Input Rhythm accompaniment and live keyboard playback Audio file playback in addition to piano. DSP can be edited on tones which can significantly alter the main level output level. I have a MOTU Interface here. While I set the TRIM to 0 for the purpose of the test the line level inputs here do have an additional gain control should I need it. It appears that you're using a Steinberg UR242 interface - I'm not sure if you can raise the level of the line inputs in their mixer application or not. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mojo of the G Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 I just received my new PX-S3000. I have the same problem, no audio output from the line outputs. Also, have the same problem with my CTK-6250 piano. However, If you connect directly to an amplifier then you get sound output but a very low volume with the 3000. Also, will not work with mixers as in my stage rack setup. I tried several audio solutions as mentioned here but all fail. I have other digital pianos, all work in my rack setup. I have concluded that Casio did not design the 3000 as a professional gigging instrument. You should not have to resort to workarounds. I am returning mine to the online retailer I bought it from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveLang Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Hmm, I have yet to try the line outs. I guess I better check it out. Since the line outputs appear to be 1/4" unbalanced, these outs should be -10dBV. Since many have used the line outputs with success, unless there's something wrong with your keyboard, you may need verify the audio inputs trims on your mixer are adjusted up for -10 levels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PianoManChuck Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 The line output levels are controlled by the Volume Knob on the front panel. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mojo of the G Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Then why does Casio not address this topic/situation in the long form user manual? There is a sub-manual that has a very short section about connecting to external amplification but is of little help. If the line outs are supposed to work then what are the particular equipment it will work with? It will only work with certain stated mixers, amp, etc.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Wait, did you have the volume knob turned down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mojo of the G Posted May 14, 2019 Share Posted May 14, 2019 Of course not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mojo of the G Posted May 14, 2019 Share Posted May 14, 2019 I did some further testing. Excluded my mixer from the line signal. There is audio output from the 3000 (adjust your levels of course) however internal speakers still sound. Plug in a dummy stereo audio plug into the headphone input and the internal speakers are muted and only the ext speakers are heard. I'm waiting for my new 16 channel mixer to arrive to test and yes I can set each channel to -10dbv. Two things: 1) it seems silly and unnecessary that it's required to use a dummy stereo jack to mute the int speakers. Casio needs to add mute circuitry to the line outs circuits and when they do we first owners like us should be able to exchange our pianos for the updated engineering change (ECO) order meaning a free swap. 2) If my new professional level mixer is not compatible with my 3000 then its just a amp hog. If you have another digital piano you'll have buy another rig. I would like to know if Casio tested this piano with several different brands of mixers and/or rigs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.