Jokeyman123 Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 Well I will need help with this one-Jokeyman stumped...!!! almost every multi-track with the midi recorder I have been creating has come out the way I expected. However.....on 2 separate recordings something vewy pecyuliar is going on awound here (Elmer Fudd) and it has only happened with drum tracks. I will record what is happening after I post this description. And it only seems to happen when I use an edited drumkit I have saved. Recording on track 10 typically, and I tried on the master track too-I get a very weird effect-as if delay is on, a very pronounced "warbly" delay. And this occurs only after I have recorded the one track, the original tone sounds just as it should from the main menu screen played live from the keys. I have no effect saved with drumkit-effect is set to "through". Checking the mixer-all the settings are similar to what I usually use-a slight bit of reverb, may be a bit of chorus-delay settings in the mixer are completely zeroed out. I have no idea what is happening here. I do have all master effects bypass on that menu page set to off, but that's the usual setting I've been keeping and this remains the same with the master effects switched in or out. Very odd. weirdness.mp3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 From what I understand, edited drum kits use a good amount of system resources. This is why Casio put a drum category blockout for zones 3 through 4 on the PX-5S. On there, if edited drum kits are used anywhere other than zone 1, they sound exactly like your clip, because the system doesn't have enough resources to render the tone on those other parts. I don't recall anything about this limit applying to the PX-560 as well. Are you using hex layer tones on other tracks? Have you tried recording the drum kit to solo track 1 instead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 11, 2019 Author Share Posted November 11, 2019 Makes some sense. Ive tried on the system track, same results. Not midi track one, and even with no other tracks recorded, still get this result. No hex layers. Ok for acid music I guess! Are there other resources I might shut down to avoid this? Would like to use edited kits-and I have with 1-2 others which dont do this. Odd. Only altering pitches in a few tones-bass drum, snare, cymbals tuning. Not an entire kit. Usually using standard kits as a baseline Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 If you have a couple of user kits that are not doing it, perhaps it's just a particular drum edit parameter or a glitch during the tone save that caused it. Parhaps try making another user drum kit similar to the first one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 11, 2019 Author Share Posted November 11, 2019 Will let you know how it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 18, 2019 Author Share Posted November 18, 2019 Still no joy. I can't understand why this won't work. There are full drumkit editing facilities as part of the PX560 operating system. Why I can't use an edited kit in a song recording doesn't seem right. I must be doing something wrong, or possibly my PX560 is malfunctioning in some way, it seems to have no other problems. Could this be an OS bug in the PX560? Brad or anyone else with a PX560, could you try this and post back. All I did to edit a kit was change the pitch of a few instruments-bass drum, hi-hat and snare primarily. Saved to a user memory slot, selected for use in track 10-although same problem occurs on any other track including the master track. Tones sound like heavy delay pr pitch-shifting with LFO. even with all effects off. Driving me crazy-well crazier than I already am! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 I don't have a PX-560 so I can't help much more. Hopefully someone with one has tried this and can help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 18, 2019 Author Share Posted November 18, 2019 Right, thanks Brad. I'll keep trying to figure out what is happening with mine. Saved sets work fine played live. Just something happening once these go through the song recorder. Even played live from the mixer screen, no problem. Appreciate you looked at this, I imagine this does not happen with the MZ-X, that is using an edited drum kit with that keyboard's midi/song recorder? This might tell me there is something wrong with my PX560 since these have so many similarities.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted November 19, 2019 Share Posted November 19, 2019 Upload your drum tone here so someone else can try it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 19, 2019 Author Share Posted November 19, 2019 OK, I have a few like this. Will do ASAP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 19, 2019 Author Share Posted November 19, 2019 Here are all 4 I have edited. Even stranger, jazz 2 is fine, jazz 1 is not. Pretty much just a variation of jazz 1. All pl;ay live no problem. I even tried using these with other arrangements I already did with other stock kits-same results. Almost sounds like a wah-wah effect, but I have no pedals connected except sustain. All registration settings are set to default-off. I have no idea what is happening here, still haven't figured it out. JAZZ1.ZDR JAZZ2.ZDR ROCKJO.ZDR JOSTNDRD.ZDR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted November 19, 2019 Share Posted November 19, 2019 Will they work in a user rhythm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 19, 2019 Author Share Posted November 19, 2019 Gol-durn-it, NO! Same blasted sound. I am comparing the jazz 1 and jazz 2 kits, seeing what is different, still no joy. I am going to program a custom kit with a hex layer-just for an experiment-I think there are wav samples I can use to spread drum tones across the keys. I'll see what happens, maybe I'll get some clue as to what is happening here. Cn't be DSP settings-jazz 1 and jazz 2 are the same-use the same routing. and I tried bringing up different registrations, seeing if that had some bearing on this for recording on the master track, but makes no difference. Does this on the master track or any other of the 16 tracks. I hav no other midi equipment, computers connected, no midi loops etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted November 19, 2019 Share Posted November 19, 2019 I'm thinking it's a bug. If someone else can confirm the same issue, that might give us hope that Tokyo can help with an update. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 19, 2019 Author Share Posted November 19, 2019 OK, thanks Brad. I could try a factory reset-but I have a feeling that won't fix this. I keep studying and changing the DSP routings, but no matter what I switch in or out, doesn't seem to make this go away. I am studying the waveforms for drum tones tonight to see what I come up with. Whoever tries this, remember it only occurs when I use the edited drum kit with the song/midi recorder. Never came across any other bugs in this PX, will be very surprised if it is. I am on the latest firmware update, never a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 20, 2019 Author Share Posted November 20, 2019 Further mystery. I just did a very small edit on a factory kit-switched the pedal hi-hat to open hi-hat next to another open hi-hat on an adjacent key. Recorded a few measures to check it-and did not get this strange warbling sound at all after I stored this edited kit. May have something to do with how I altered the pitches with the bass and snare sounds, but then it does this on the cymbals too. As far as the hex layers-there are no drum or percussion waves to play with-just the tuned percussion so that idea is a no-go-I was hoping to create a drum kit with a hex layer for an experiment to see if i could find out what is happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kybdsammer Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 Jokeyman, I downloaded your .ZDR files and loaded. I did not tweak anything and just selected your tones and recorded to wav and to the midi recorder. Recording to wav had no issues. However, when using midi recorder, I encountered a very noticeable warbling sound on first 3 none on the last (mp3 attached - not a great recording but just to give you an idea). Definitely not expected. The warbling sound is especially noticeable on the crash. Is this similar to what you are experiencing? Sequence in mp3: Jazz JOE1, Jazz JOE2, Standardjoe1, and then Rock Joe 20191119 Edited drums midi recorded.mp3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 20, 2019 Author Share Posted November 20, 2019 Exactly. Something is going on between editing and saving the kits, which work perfectly played from the keys, but once recorded in the midi/song recorder, the "warbling" sound is very distinct. Doesn't matter which track I use, which registration, no DSP settings seem to make any difference., lmost sounds like an LFO is active, but not on all the sounds in the kit, but the ones I edited are doing this-the snare, cymbals, bass drum. Brad is helping too. Definitely would like to get this solved, especially since the facility to edit kits is in there. If you come up with anything, please post back. Now I know it is not unique to my PX560. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Martin Posted November 20, 2019 Share Posted November 20, 2019 Confirmed it here. We're checking into this further. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 20, 2019 Author Share Posted November 20, 2019 Thanks much Mike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 21, 2019 Author Share Posted November 21, 2019 An update on my trying to figure this out. when I edited one of the "warbly" drum kits-I was able to get it to record properly again-but only after I changed the pitch settings for the bass drums, cymbals and snare drums back to their original pitches as from the factory. So seems this problem comes from altering the pitches on a variety of snare, cymbal and bass drum tones. One other question, might be related to this. Can someone explain what the "assign group" actually is for? I'm not quite sure I understand how this works-with a range of "off" to number 1-15, I do not understand how this works. I believe it will stop one percussion sound from playing when another is played from the keyboard, but what are all the number options for? The manual doesn't seem to describe what this is doing. Since the drum kits are giving me trouble with editing, though this might have something to do with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 Preset hi-hats are an example of assign groups. You are correct that one sounds stops when another key is played, basically a mono mode. A number of "mono mode" groups can be made. Simply assign several instruments a group number to create a "mono mode" group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jokeyman123 Posted November 21, 2019 Author Share Posted November 21, 2019 So, if I get this correctly-I could create different 15 mono mode groups, all in the same kit? Not sure I'd need to, but that is pretty powerful editing. I assign 4 separate drum sounds to assign group 1, three others to 2, etc. and these would cut off only the other instruments in that assign group? is that correct? Wow! Could get pretty crazy there... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Saucier Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 Yep. This is the same level of drum kit editing from the PX-5S, which also made it's way into the MZ-X series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Martin Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 Temporary solution. Use user memory locations 25 or 36 for your user kit and you shouldn't have any problems. The Tokyo team will look into this further. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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